Horizontal Air Cooled Engine

[Richard Hed]

Okay!!!---Christmas is over. Santa did come. Second son showed up for Christmas dinner and brought his new Ojibway girlfriend. (she is a very nice girl). Everybody else stayed home and "Christmassed" with their families---Too much Covid around for big family get togethers. When I put that o-ring groove in the top of the cylinder, I grabbed the wrong size endmill.---Poop!!! It has been fixed with a steel back-up ring to fill up the extra space, and now the groove is 3/32" wide to accept the 1/16" o-ring.. Work is proceeding on the engine. New cylinder is finished. New cylinder head is 3/4 finished.

I was reading about Ojibway and related languages. Does she speak Ojibway?

 

[Brian Rupnow]

I'm not sure Richard. We are putting on our best face for her, and not asking too many personal questions. She is very pleasant and the relationship is still very new.

 

[Richard Hed]

I'm not sure Richard. We are putting on our best face for her, and not asking too many personal questions. She is very pleasant and the relationship is still very new.

My son speaks a bundle of languages which he, himself, took the initiative to learn. I encourage him to learn one of the local Indigenous languages (most likely Colville or Spokane) but the problem is that the languages are not easy to get materials for unless one lives near a Jr. college that teaches that language which is basically near the tribes that originally spoke that language. The Indians that at one time existed in Grant County, the great bend of the Columbia, no longer exist, not even on the res. So there are no indigenous languages here. He would have to travel 2 hrs each way to learn at a Jr. college. What I would REALLY like him to learn is Navaho or Hopi as I like their cultural ideas.

The Algonkian group is your area which extends down to about Colorado, but is quite different at that place. My local group are known as Salish. It is a shame that we have lost those languages out of ignorance and the attempt to assimilate the Native Americans. Had the Americas Known 150 years ago what we know now, this would not have happened. At least there is an attempt to bring back the languages. There is a lot of resentment amongst the tribes for this, and yet there are many who also realize it is not all bad.

I was reading about the tribes of Quebec demonsstrating a few years ago about their rights. That information was kept out of the United States very effectively. I might have gone myself.

 

[Steamchick]

I grew up in a county whichhas been argued about since 1604. A Welsh bishop and Engish bishop both wanted tithes from Monmouthshire, so both argued and claimed the money! Currently the land is in Wales, but I was born when it was in England. I was in school when it was moved - for the 10th time? - so they decided to find someone to teach us the Welsh National anthem - in Welsh. Only 1 person knew a relative that could speak Welsh, so they got a tape recording and we learnt the Anthem. But now at Wales v anyone Rugby matches, they sing a different version, as I was taught "old" Welsh, not 1970s modernised Welsh!
So why do we try to resurrect "old" languages? Even the English of today is different from the 1950s and 1960s language I learned... 16th century English would be unintelligable to me now....
Of course, where languages have not been erased by history, the current (if radically changed) version is still valid. And it is good to raise children as bi-lingual, as they have a better ability to learn new languages later in life.
K2

 

[Richard Hed]

I grew up in a county whichhas been argued about since 1604. A Welsh bishop and Engish bishop both wanted tithes from Monmouthshire, so both argued and claimed the money! Currently the land is in Wales, but I was born when it was in England. I was in school when it was moved - for the 10th time? - so they decided to find someone to teach us the Welsh National anthem - in Welsh. Only 1 person knew a relative that could speak Welsh, so they got a tape recording and we learnt the Anthem. But now at Wales v anyone Rugby matches, they sing a different version, as I was taught "old" Welsh, not 1970s modernised Welsh!
So why do we try to resurrect "old" languages? Even the English of today is different from the 1950s and 1960s language I learned... 16th century English would be unintelligable to me now....
Of course, where languages have not been erased by history, the current (if radically changed) version is still valid. And it is good to raise children as bi-lingual, as they have a better ability to learn new languages later in life.
K2

In the case of Britain, it is much like any other place,: stamp out a language, suppress a home rule movement. That is very much the same reason it was done in this country. But . . . native languages contained methods--in built in the language--for survival on the hunter gatherer level. Information that is surely lost. However, the pharmaceutical companies would certainly like to have at least one part of that language preserved. When I was a kid (last week) there was a small bush across the road from our house which had little berries in clusters. I asked my dad if we could eat them. No, they were poison. Well, it turned out these berries are related to all those fruits with pits that we know: peaches, cherries and most of all plums. These little fruits have at least three names: June Plum, Indian Plum and Osoberry. Look up Oso berry and you will see it. Turns out to be quite edible and tastes like cantaloupe, of all things.

There are hundreds of fruits and plants and medical stuff if not more that their uses have been lost. All across the Americas, I'm sure this is in the thousands of plants. Don't forget the animals either. You can eat crow if you forget. The thing is, that the Indians would have been assimilated sooner or later anyway without being forced to learn English writing and ways. It is quite the opposite way to do things. We should have taught them writing--yes, but THEIR language. Look what happened with we Cherokees when we learned to read and write Cherokee which ended in TWO trails of tears.

This is an awful chapter of general/president jackson that is quite kept out of the history books. I'm sure you would like to read about Chief Sequoia and what he accomplished and why we were crushed for no good reason.

Languages inherently have methods to thimpfk in different ways. It is impossible to explain to those who know only one language, like what is he taste of the color blue (just joking, explain the colors to a blind person). I could bore you with a couple hundred more pages, but then I's get spanked for being off topic.

Anyway, what's wrong with being taxed by two or three different authorities? We get taxed in this country for everything we do except breathe. They'll figure out a way to tax that too. We get national tax, state tax, county tax, city tax, and because of all that, heart-a-tax.

 

[Brian Rupnow]

The engine has been reassembled with a new cylinder, a new cylinder head, and a Viton o-ring head gasket. I'm not going to try and start it today, as I've just Loctited the carburetor into the brass adapter and I want it to set up good before I start messing with it. Somebody on one of the forums I post on has recently built a multi cylindered radial engine, and he said that he didn't put any angle on the valve seats, just left them sharp cornered, and that he got great compression with no lapping. This didn't seem reasonable to me, but I thought "If it worked for him, maybe it would work for me."---It doesn't. Tomorrow I will pull the head off and use my magic George Britnell tool to put an angle on the valve seats the way I usually do. I'm getting awfully good at pulling the head of this engine.

 

[stevehuckss396]

So did you drop down to the 1/4-32 spark plug and save the 5/16 (rescue plug) for another time?

 

[Brian Rupnow]

No, I am using the "rescue plug". I did pull the head off and used my George Britnell tool to put a chamfer on the valve cages, and then lapped the valves as per usual since my last post. Compression came up fine after doing that. New o-ring head gasket seems to be working fine. I've just came downstairs from eating dinner, and expected the engine to start . It didn't, and I'm not sure why. Valve and ignition timing are set right, lots of spark at the sparkplug when it's laying out on the deck, and it's getting lots of gas. I may have to pull the head off and see if the end of the sparkplug is too shrouded by the aluminum head material. I'll have to sleep on that one. I can counterbore the deck to let the plug intrude a bit more into the cylinder, or I can take some material out on the inside of the head. There isn't an awful lot of material with threads in it, and I have to be careful about what material I take out.

 

[Steamchick]

On valve seats... Stick with what works for you.
You have so much experience, you know what makes sense. Otherwise I can't suggest what may be causing the lack of bangs... A richer mixture will often get things going, so then it is just a matter of tuning...?
K2.

 

[Steamchick]

Or can you retard the ignition a bit until it fires? That does 2 things, It sparks when the compressed gas is more compressed and hotter, as often the cranking speed is lower than idle. And gives a better chance for running without kick-back. If you have an electronic trigger, it may not be getting a signal for the spark at cranking speed, with the plug in and proper compression slowing the cranking speed compared to when the plug is on the bench..?
K2

 

[Brian Rupnow]

I'm using the 5/16"-24 that was made for me. Last night I lay in bed thinking---I don't want to mess with the head. That is the third head that I have made, it's a lot of work, and I don't want to make a fourth head. I have came up with a third way to get that sparkplug deeper into the combustion area without touching the cylinder head. If I can run the thread up another 0.100" on the plug body, that accomplishes what I want to do. That way I don't have to do anything to the cylinder head nor to the cylinder.

 

[awake]

I'm getting awfully good at pulling the head of this engine.

Well, that's one way to get ahead ...

 

[dsage]

Try starting fluid. It'll rule out quite a few things and get you going in the right direction quickly.

 

[Brian Rupnow]

I ran a die all the way up to the hex shape on the sparkplug, which gained me about 0.100". That didn't help---engine still won't fire. Tried advancing the spark timing a little---engine won't fire. tried indexing the plug--engine wouldn't fire. Tried retarding the spark a little----engine won't fire. Got really, really desperate and tried some ether---engine won't fire. Took out piston with cast iron rings and put in a piston with viton o-ring---engine won't fire. Tried holding a spare finger over the carb air horn to choke it while spinning engine with my "starter-drill"---choked it until raw gas was coming out the exhaust.---engine didn't fire. I'm just about out of tricks. If I pull the plug and lay it out on the deck, plug fires like crazy while engine is being cranked. My sparkplug boot is transparent, and I can see fire jumping like crazy from the end of the wire to the top end of the plug when engine is being cranked over. (It wouldn't do that if plug wasn't firing.) Compression isn't real great, but then with these engines I build, the compression generally isn't great until the engine starts and runs for 10 or 15 minutes to seat the valves 100%--then they have crazy compression. Bottom line is, that in all of this head changing and sparkplug changing, the engine has only fired once and that was a result of indexing the sparkplug. It fired once and immediately blew the head gasket. Valve lash is set at "about" 0.010", valves are definitely closed when not up on the cam lobes. The internal shape of the combustion chamber is the same as countless other engines I have made, that ran successfully. I'm totally buffaloed for the moment.

 

[johwen]

Time to try another coil or spark wire cable. It is obvious there is no spark at the plug under compression. This could be because the spark voltage is too weak to jump the gap under compression pressure. Try the ignition coil set up on and engine you know runs and see if it starts. Close spark plug gap down to about .020" as if the coil is week it may jump a smaller gap. If you have compression and fuel then the only other requirement is spark. If you have fuel and compression the only other area is spark not getting to the plug. John

 

[minh-thanh]

Compression isn't real great, but then with these engines I build, the compression generally isn't great until the engine starts and runs for 10 or 15 minutes to seat the valves 100%--then they have crazy compression.

The valve and seat will be more airtight when the engine is running I don't know but I think it depends on the valve surface and seat surface,
When I make the engine, I always try to make the valve and seat airtight from the beginning, If the piston, ring, cylinder is ok then the engine always has good compression from the beginning, then I only care about the ignition timing as well as the spark

 

[Brian Rupnow]

So, here I am at the end of a 9 week build. To achieve this build in that time span required that I worked on some aspect of the engine every day of that 9 weeks. The engine looks good, I am satisfied with that. I am confused as to why the engine won't fire. There is nothing here that is different from all of my other running engines, other than the sparkplug. The sparkplugs are brand new, from a different supplier, and far be it for me to question a brand new sparkplug. There is a possibility that the plug is shorting out internally, but if it was shorting out internally, then it would short out internally when laid out on the block. It doesn't. It gives a bright blue spark just like a good sparkplug should. My "need to machine something" has been satisfied (for now). Now I go into the detective phase of this build, and that is the part I don't really care for. I know I have fuel. I know I have compression. I'm not 100% sure I have spark. Even an engine with screwed up valve or ignition timing will fire when the engine is being turned by an electric drill. It may fire at the wrong time in the cycle, it may just give "pops and farts", but it will fire. You can hear it fire, and you can see smoke, and the cylinder will get warm. You can feel it kicking back against the drill when it fires. I'm undecided where this will take me now, but I will be sure to keep you informed.---Brian

 

[Gordon]

I don't want to question your conclusions but I have had similar situations where the battery was too weak to produce a good spark under compression. Check to be sure that your battery is at full charge. Perhaps use your battery/ignition box on another engine. If the other engine runs it almost has to be the spark plug.

 

[Brian Rupnow]

The sparkplug is not leaking around the threads. Someone on one of my forums didn't believe me when I said that the engine did have adequate compression, so they wanted a visual on it. Here it is. This doesn't get me anywhere closer to having the engine run, but it is kind of a fun video.

 

[stevehuckss396]

I sent 2 plugs. Have you tried the other one? If so the plug with the smaller gap would be my preferred plug. I test every plug before they leave here. I have also had that design in my peewee for 11 years and they still work very well. I stand behind my plugs so if you think that is the problem I can have replacement plugs in the mail in just a few days at no charge. I will even cover the postage.