Another Karl Benz 1886 Engine and Motor Wagon.

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Edward Perera

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Having got inspired by the thread started by gg89220, I purchased the castings from TS Models-Germany, and started work. As some time was spent before the castings arrived, I thought of doing some work on the Wagon. I contacted TonyM, who also was showing interest in gg89220's build, regarding constructing the Wagon. After a few communications I constructed the wheels first.
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The tube frame was formed, and by that time the castings were received.
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Pictures of the engine construction will follow soon.
 

BluSky

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Hello Edward,
I have also build this engine with castings from Thorsten Schuer.
May I draw your attention to a bug in the drawings (at least my copy) relating the camshaft bracket.
The distance between camshaft center and center of the outlet lever pin (Auslasshebel) is too small given on the drawing. It is recommeded to check the distance before drilling the outlet lever pin hole.
Two cutouts of the drawing will give additional information.

The distance calculated from the drawing is 16.8 mm.
jfgejhai.png

The required distance was 17.75 mm at least
feccgggf.png

Hope this helps

Regards
Richard
 

johwen

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Having got inspired by the thread started by gg89220, I purchased the castings from TS Models-Germany, and started work. As some time was spent before the castings arrived, I thought of doing some work on the Wagon. I contacted TonyM, who also was showing interest in gg89220's build, regarding constructing the Wagon. After a few communications I constructed the wheels first.
View attachment 116077
View attachment 116078
View attachment 116079
The tube frame was formed, and by that time the castings were received.
View attachment 116080
Pictures of the engine construction will follow soon.
Hi this is john from Melbourne Australia and I was wondering if you have any contact details for the castings an Plans for the Vehicle. I would be ever so grateful if you could advise as It looks like a model i would be most interested in building
 

TonyM

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Thanks Richard that certainly helped me.
I am currently making the engine too. My drawing shows the 10mm increased to 12 but I am still not happy with the position. It seems too high up. I need to check the end plates are correct too.
Have you stuck with the TS plan or have you changed the position of the bevel gear to the same as the original. I have reverted back to the original design with the large bevel gear nearest the cam therefore the camshaft/pulley shaft rotates in the opposite direction to the TS plans. I moved the pin for the inlet pushrod 180 degrees because of the reverse rotation.
Everything else fits well but I think the inlet and exhaust overlap far too much. Can you tell me on yours what position the exhaust valve is in when the inlet starts to open.
Thanks TonyM
 

BluSky

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Hello Tony,
unfortunatelly I discovered the bug first when I had already drilled the holes. I discussed the situation with TS. He recommended to shorten the cam hub a little to cope with the gap resulting also in a bigger cam edge. Otherwise I would have to manufacture a new bracket.
I followed the recommendation of TS.
For the exhaust valve he recommended opening of the valve starts 10° before BDC and closing should be finished at 5° after TDC. The inlet starts to open at 20° before TDC. This is in the drawings description included and he confirmed that. So I did.
The final data of adjustment I have not in mind any more.
My motor is not a real great runner. I assumed it is by reason of scaling an early original engine causes always some trouble, for example the inlet valve is a flat plate which will give complications to get it completely tight and smooth running at the same time.
Also it might be better to fabricate an extra carburetor from own drawing sources than to use the drawing of TS.

Richard
 

TonyM

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Thanks Richard. I am sure this discussion will help Edward too.
I will check what I have. I have a feeling that the valve timing could be improved dramatically without too much change. Maybe the inlet pivot point can be improved.
On the subject of the carb I intend to use a surface carb. I made a post here asking for constructive criticism. I would appreciate your thoughts.
 

Edward Perera

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Hi this is john from Melbourne Australia and I was wondering if you have any contact details for the castings an Plans for the Vehicle. I would be ever so grateful if you could advise as It looks like a model i would be most interested in building
Hi, John,
Sorry, I do not have any info regarding Castings and Plans for the Wagon. I thought that building the wheels and the frame (1/3 scale) was the easiest way to get along with the construction. For rest of the parts I may have to work by observing the images from the internet.

Edward.
Sri Lanka.
 

Edward Perera

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Hello Edward,
I have also build this engine with castings from Thorsten Schuer.
May I draw your attention to a bug in the drawings (at least my copy) relating the camshaft bracket.
The distance between camshaft center and center of the outlet lever pin (Auslasshebel) is too small given on the drawing. It is recommeded to check the distance before drilling the outlet lever pin hole.
Two cutouts of the drawing will give additional information.

The distance calculated from the drawing is 16.8 mm.View attachment 116422
The required distance was 17.75 mm at least
View attachment 116423
Hope this helps

Regards
Richard
Hi, Richard,
Glad to hear that you already built the Benz Engine using castings supplied by TS.
Thank you very much for pointing out the error on the drawings.
For some reason these dimensions are corrected by TS in the drawings those I received.
I projected two drawings in the autocad using old and new dimensions.
The attached images will show them in detail.
Thank you,
Edward
Sri Lanka.

IMG_2794web.jpg
IMG_2796web.jpg
 

TonyM

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Looking good Edward. Does that carburettor give reasonable engine speed control using the Jan Ridders surface carb. I'd love to see a video.
 

Ken Brunskill

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The plans come with the casting set from Dampfmaschinen, Motoren, Generatoren
The castings are good but the plans have a few errors and instructions are only in German. The plans show the camshaft gears are reversed to the original engine giving reverse rotation of the drive.
Thank you TonyM, I have a niece in law who can translate for me, I'm considering it. Are you building one now, if so how good are the castings?
 

TonyM

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The castings are mostly aluminium. Reasonably good quality with no porosity, Spigots etc. are well positioned so holes are relatively central. Flywheel and base are CI. The flywheel had no hard spots and needed minimum fettling. Altogether very pleased with the result. I wanted to make mine nearer the original so have made a few mods to the plans. The camshaft gears being the main one. Mine is the same orientation as Edwards
 

gg89220

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hello
I added a setting for the intake without adjusting the cam
IMG_3604.JPG
 

Ken Brunskill

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The castings are mostly aluminium. Reasonably good quality with no porosity, Spigots etc. are well positioned so holes are relatively central. Flywheel and base are CI. The flywheel had no hard spots and needed minimum fettling. Altogether very pleased with the result. I wanted to make mine nearer the original so have made a few mods to the plans. The camshaft gears being the main one. Mine is the same orientation as Edwards
Beautiful work! You are to be congratulated. I am considering drawing this up in Solidworks as I think the castings could be replicated as weldments. Would you mind if I asked some dimensional questions so I could get the scale right? The other thing is I see a cam to an electrical component suggesting it is a gas not diesel engine, however I do not see any spark plug, or wires to where there might be one, where is it?
 

TonyM

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Most of the beautiful work you see in this thread has been done by Edward. I have not posted any pictures of my engine. Why not email Tolsten Shur and ask if he will send you a GA drawing.
 
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