Prusa XL 3D Printer

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GreenTwin

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I just found out about a new 14"x14"x14" print area 3D printer that will be offered by Prusa (called the Prusa XL).

I was hoping they would come out with something more like a 24" cubed print area, but this is the size they are offering.
Compared to commercial 3D printers, the price is not too bad.

I will have to consider one of these printers for pattern making.
It would save a lot of time.

Looks like many improvements over the last model.

https://www.prusa3d.com/product/original-prusa-xl-2/
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Build your own. The motion hardware just relies on some settings in the software. My son has done that a couple times to make a very tall printer.
 
I have seen quite a few folks build their own 3D printers successfully.

I am in a position where I don't have much time, and any time spent on making things has to be compared with money lost when I could be working.

So a Prusa XL is inexpensive for me, since it would cost me perhaps 10 times that much if I built it myself.

Time = money

If I were retired (I am not), it would be a different story, where I would have an almost infinite amount of time, and a finite amount of money.


Edit:

And another consideration for me is that I consider any time not spent on engine design and casting to be a diversion down a fork in the road, and so I can easily lose sight of my main goal if I am not careful, which is to design, cast, and build functional engines.

I have all sorts of hobbies, and I have to pick and choose which ones to focus on intensely, otherwise there is the danger that everything gets watered down to the point where I never really get anything done, and more importantly engines don't get built.


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I am thinking about purchasing the Sovol SV03 since it has good reviews. It is direct drive, which is very good. It also has a BL-Touch pre-installed. It is also fairly large at 350x350x400. The negative is that it has a big, moving bed. In other words, it is not CoreXY. However i dont know much about pricing currently searching here. I think that I am going to buy one to tide me over until Prusa can deliver the Prusa XL.
 
Prusa has delayed the XL due to supply chain problems, and some changes to the design.

They had to find another processor chip (or chips), and rework the firmware, which I am sure is extremely time consuming.

I am not sure if the XL will hit the market.
It sounds like they will be able to make a limited quantity of them, but it is looking like demand is going to far exceed supply for the foreseeable future.

I am wondering when I pre-ordered my XL.
I can't recall if I ordered it the same day as I received the advertisement, or whether I hesitated a few days/weeks.

Prusa is talking about filling the first day orders, and so if I am on that list, I may get one.

If I am not on the fist day list, then it may be a year or more before I can get one.

So far I just have made a refundable deposit, so I guess I wait it out.

Edit:
I don't need it right now, but if I ever retire, it would be something nice to have.

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Have you considered the Elegoo Saturn 2 as an alternate? The build is a lot smaller (8.62 x 4.84 x 9.84), but you can break the model up if you need to (or buy two). I've found dealing with the resin mess a bigger time saver than messing with my extruder and all the post-process sanding & filling. My extruder machine caught fire once (fixed with correct gauge wire + mosfet) and has had thermal runaway from the temp probe coming lose. I'm a little biased on my experience for sure.

Both types require some troubleshooting to start out and you probably don't need the resolution for casting. When the time comes that you need it though it's really nice.
 
I have a Prusa MK3S, and so it is not like I actually need another 3D printer right now, but like I said, in the future, it would be nice to have a larger format printer.

I have decided not to get a resin printer.
After reading about the mess, smell, and other problems, I won't be getting one.

I will stick with extruder machines.
They work quite well, but I could use a larger format machine.

I have looked at some BIG 3D printers, such as 36" cubed, but that is just a pipe dream.

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The supply chain is not good these days, as far as chips, and many other things such as electrical equipment.

An electrical equipment sales rep said they have trouble getting resin, which is what all the insulators are made of.

Another rep for outdoor medium voltage equipment said his manufacturer had stopped making equipment that has chips in it that they cannot source.
So entire product lines are just going away.

Strange world these days.
The manufacturer of too much stuff got concentrated in one country, and things won't improve until that is diversified to other countries that don't have harsh and ongoing shutdowns.
Lots of folks are moving their plants out of the problem countries, and some are reshoring to the US and other countries.

Its never really a good idea to single-source everything from one country.

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Strange world these days.
The manufacturer of too much stuff got concentrated in one country, and things won't improve until that is diversified to other countries that don't have harsh and ongoing shutdowns.
Lots of folks are moving their plants out of the problem countries, and some are reshoring to the US and other countries.

Its never really a good idea to single-source everything from one country.

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I agree! As a retired machine designer/builder who worked in manufacturing for about 60 years I have been greatly saddened by the move to offshore manufacturing. Now, to bring things back, there will be a HUGE lack of human resources that know what to do. It would take decades to re-populate manufacturing facilities, but the pay required to compete would be lower than US workers would accept now. It would take big changes in taxing of imports to make it feasible now, raising prices on products. It is going to be a tough change, IF it ever happens to any real degree.
 
I am always shocked when I see or visit modern manufacturing plants in the US these days.
Its always "Where is everybody?".

Lots of robots and mechanization.
Not many people, even in very large plants.

That seems to be the trend.
Gone are the days of 2,000 folks walking into the plant on every shift.

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Have you considered the Elegoo Saturn 2 as an alternate? The build is a lot smaller (8.62 x 4.84 x 9.84), but you can break the model up if you need to (or buy two). I've found dealing with the resin mess a bigger time saver than messing with my extruder and all the post-process sanding & filling. My extruder machine caught fire once (fixed with correct gauge wire + mosfet) and has had thermal runaway from the temp probe coming lose. I'm a little biased on my experience for sure.

Both types require some troubleshooting to start out and you probably don't need the resolution for casting. When the time comes that you need it though it's really nice.
Yikes - I hope you mean that the firmware shut down the machine due to thermal runaway, not that it actually ran away and overheated! There are horror stories on-line for machines that did not have the thermal runaway protection enabled, which seems insane to me - it is simply a matter of setting a parameter in the build of the firmware.
 
I just got an email from Prusa.

The single-head XL shipping will start in March of this year.

Multi-head machines will take two months longer to begin shipping.

I ordered a single-head machine, but I have no idea where I am on the Prusa order list.
I could be number 100, or number 50,000.

If they can begin shipping any units at all, that would be better than nothing.

I am a bit wary of a new and untested (untested by the general public at large) machine, but I know Prusa will stand behind their machines no matter what.

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My D6 clone had a 50 cent 10A relay controlling the 24V power circuit, that would see over a 12A load whenever just the extruder and bed heaters were both on. These relays regularly failed. The OEM's solution was to show you how to bypass this relay, which eliminated the software safeties for heating.

My solution, a 20A relay that had the same footprint as the original 10A relay - cost me the outrageous sum of $1.99.

Don
 
The Prusa XL's are starting to ship.

From the Prusa website, it says they received thousands of orders in the first few minutes of pre-sale.

So it looks like the initial roll-out will be slow, but it does appear to be happening.
I still don't know where my order falls on the order list.
I could be #1000 or #100,000.


Looks like the machine has a lot of interesting features.

Looks like some significant improvements were added after beta testing.

The use of multi-materials is pretty interesting.
I don't fully understand how they mix soluble and insoluble material in the same print, but that would be an very useful feature for sure.

Lets hope it lives up to the hype, but I am guessing it will become the standard of the industry, judging from the effort Prusa is putting into this machine.



https://blog.prusa3d.com/original-prusa-xl-now-shipping_75721/
 
So as an example of what this printer could be capable of, you could print perhaps 20 mini-Wilton vices (or more) on this size print bed, and then do a lost-PLA casting of many vices at the same time.

In essence, you would be side-stepping the lost wax process, which is a big deal.

Lots of potential with this printer.

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Hi Folks,

Lots of interesting things happening in higher end (and even low end) 3D printers these days. Bambu Labs is shaking things up for turn key high speed printing, but with some issues and only in the 256mm^2 build volumes. Prusa and Voron Labs (designs only, not a "product") are doing large CoreXY stuff, and lower end makers are going hard into large printers for those who want to print one piece cosplay helmets and such. The 3D printed model aircraft folks have been playing large volume games for years, lots of info out there from them. Long thin stuff like rockets and aircraft wings sure are a good fit for high speed large Z height Deltas like the FLSun V400.

I saw the Prusa XL prototype / pre production machine at ERRF last October, it looked to be a good core XY well built machine. The stated plan is to open source everything as the machine moves to production, a big plus compared to Bambu, Build volume is obviously nuts for a home machine (in a good way). About the only thing that struck me as odd was the nozzles are specific to the machine. BUT - The nozzles are very long, bypassing the entire discontinuity between nozzle, hot zone, heat break, filament guide as found in most printers. Prusa expects to have a variety of hardened and normal brass nozzles available at shipping time or shortly thereafter, and expects aftermarket makers to provide them as well. Several times Prusa employees have said they are focusing on print quality first and speed second, a nice change from all the folks showing off vaguely boat like blob benchies that printed in under 5 minutes.

Like most Prusa machines, it's pricey, but the components are all good quality. Sort of like saying my RatRig V Minion is way overpriced compared to a Kingroon mini. It will be interesting to see how Prusa does with this machine, the MK3 series has been sitting at a high price point distinguished from products at 1/4 the price or even less mostly by name and customer support. I wish them well, the company shares a lot with everyone who does 3D printing regardless of the machine(s) you use. I really like that fact that they did not put a bar across the upper front of the frame, numerous folks have removed these from other "cube" printers with no issues and having a cross member in this location really gets in the way. It's the worst attribute of my Ender5 S1, but the Ender5 frame is not rigid enough to take this off, so I added corner connectors to stiffen the frame up beyond stock. Turning a negative into a positive is about the best that can be done in this case.

The Prusa XL is maybe 10mm in all dimensions that the largest Voron kits I know of, and building a Voron is quite a bit of work. A good quality Voron 350mm^2 kit is around $1500 USD (Fabreeko pricing), plus a Pi ($150 these days), all the printed parts (days of printing ABS/ASA and several spools or $150+ to buy from a service), and a hot end ($80 plus). Add effort and money in assorted amounts to get swappable tool heads, but figure a couple hundred dollars anyway. It will take days to build a Voron as well, my simple V minion was two days from opening the boxes to first test print and resonance testing, a Voron is far more difficult to build. At $1000 more ready to go, with tool head changer and two tool heads, the XL looks pretty good if you need it's capabilities. Unlike the high waste of a Bambu with multi material options, swapping toolheads produces very little waste beyond purges and allows mixing materials that print at differing temperatures, something that is hard to get right when using a single print head and change just the filament approach. Having the well regarded Prusa support behind the printer might be worth it to some folks, some vendors respond slowly or with silence or excuses, Prusa tends to respond with answers and fixes or parts. I don't own a Prusa, too rich for my budget, but an XL or a decent IDEX printer really tempts me. If the XL delivers, I think it will be the absolute best multi material FDM large volume fairly high speed yet affordable printer in existence. Bambu may be able to support 16 filaments in theory, but the single print head means lots of waste out the rear of the machine, and many folks are having trouble with getting even the base 4 spool filament feeder (AMS) to work reliably.

Where something like the Bambu P1P could excel is a print farm doing medium and small sized prints. You could buy 4 P1P printers for the price of a single PrusaXL. Most print farms are just churning single color stuff out at an OK quality, in PLA. In a print farm, you want consistency, having twelve different slicer configs for 12 different printers is a nightmare. Reliability is huge, hobbyists may enjoys tweaking initial layer heights every other day, but for production you just want an appliance that works without added drama.

There's a lot to like about the XL on paper, we'll see how it performs once a thousand of them are out in the real world.

Print speed will be interesting to see. The Bambu printers are fast, but somehow all the Bambu fan boys, who are almost fanatical in some cases, make excuses for, or ignore, the print quality. You can tell it's a boat, just look from the right angle! And it printed in 7 minutes! And so what? I wouldn't put it on any diorama or model railroad layout unless it was as junk in the back of a boat yard under overgrowth. Maybe. I see people carrying on about some big print that took 2 days on an Ender3 finishing in only 18 hours on their Bambu, but the vertical surfaces look quite poor to me. The Bambu is also closed source and uses proprietary parts, with a build volume of about 250mm^2. Voron print quality can be excellent, but many folks building these focus on speed and use large nozzles for high flow rate. Which might be a good call for something like a flywheel casting pattern that can be readily hit with body filler and sanded if doing conventional casting. Not so hot for lost PLA or printed wax though...

If your primary concern is build volume rather than speed and multi-materials you might also consider either the Ender5 Plus or the Anycubic Kobra Max. Odds are the print quality will be fine if you don't push to the max on speed and you'll be staying under $600 for the same or larger build volume. Won't be the same quality of machine, or as fast, but if big prints are only occasionally needed does it really matter if one takes two days to print instead of 23 hours? I print stuff overnight regularly, printing the smaller prints during the day to get a couple of prints done, then setting up the big part(s) and verifying the first few layers are good then head off the house for the night.

For some folks, I think a large volume OK quality FDM printer for big stuff and a resin printer for small detailed parts could be an excellent compromise solution. Getting to lower than 100 micron layer heights and resolution with FDM is pretty shaky, some folks have managed 80 micron layer heights with 0.25mm nozzles. The cheapest resin printers have 50 micron layer heights out of the box, with just under 30 micron resolution in many of the 8K printers on the market. Each technology has weaknesses and strengths, materials keep getting better though.

Cheers,
Stan
 
That is some good info Stan.

The 3D printing business seems to be going similar to early auto manufacturers, ie: everybody and their brother got into the auto manufacturing game, but in the end, only a few manufacturers succeeded.

I buy Prusa products because they stand behind them (in my experience), and so I am assured that the printer will work, and I can get the help I need if things don't work right.

Someone said that I can save a lot of money by purchasing the un-assembled kit and putting it together myself.
The opposite is true; I am very busy with work projects, and so putting together a 3D printer would be very expensive for me, since I could be making money on work projects instead.

Initial cost is really not a critical factor for me.
I look at total cost over time, and how well a product works; ie: does the product work almost problem-free, because time lost dealing with a troublesome piece of equipment is very expensive for me.

The Prusa guy seems to eat, sleep, walk, and dream about 3D printers 24/7, and that is the type of person that I see succeeding in the long term, and the type person I want to design and build my 3D printer.

And I am very big on open-source products, and I think that will keep Prusa going when proprietary companies fail.
Open source products create this sort of synergy (if that is the right term), where everyone jumps in and starts designing all sorts of spin-off complimentary products, and the whole thing just goes viral as far as product offerings from a wide array of manufacturers, not just Prusa.

One thing that convinced me to use Prusa's is the fact that they used print farms with their own machines early on.
There is nothing quite like running a machine all day every day to work out reliability issues.

I think 3D printers are in their infancy, and still have a long way to go, but I am excited about what is offered at this point, and excited about the possibilites in the future.

If I can ever get an XL, I will definitely be printing 1-piece flywheel pattern halves up to 12" diameter, and a whole lot of other engine part patterns too.




 
Another way to look at it is that I would prefer to focus my limited available time on making 3D models for engines, and printing the patterns for those engines, instead of building 3D printers.

Its a matter of focus and priority.

It is basically whatever you have fun doing, but my end-game focus is to make engine castings and build engines, and let someone else sort out the 3D printer stuff.

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I bought a Prusa I3Mk3s+ a couple of years ago- I looked around at a lot of printers prior to buying and dismissed most of them as basically toys. I wanted a printer to actually print things I wanted to use, not a printer to play with, rebuild, or modify to get consistent useable prints. The Prusa has not disappointed me, results are consistently excellent.

I've had the XL pre-ordered almost since day one- can't wait to get it as I do a fair bit of multi-colour printing and am looking forward to the day I don't have to stand in front of the printer waiting to change filament multiple times.

The biggest problem I have with waiting for the XL is looking at that money I have patiently saved up, just sitting there in the bank, and thinking of all the other great toys I can buy with it RIGHT NOW!!
 
Here is apparently the latest news on the XL.

Sounds like it went through beta testing, and they made improvements.

Nice manifold print.

https://blog.prusa3d.com/original-prusa-xl-now-shipping_75721/

DSC1249-copy-640x502.jpg
 

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