Need help..Engine ID 4 cly Fltat-head

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Capt,n John

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I am looking for all the information I can get on a 4 cyl Flat-head engine. It is in nice condition, but with no coil. I would like too complete the ignition and maybe use a small motorcycle coil. Need to know the easy/best way to do it. It says E Wall, Chicago Ill on the side of the engine. Thanks in advance. Capt,n.


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I have figured out the firing order of my 4 cyl Wall engine. I need to get a coil for it and may need a wire diagram for the coil and where to make it a good working ignition. Any help would be good. Thanks, John stickpoke
 
Forgot to say...I have better photos now to upload here. Thanks
 
What options are there for coil size & type? What voltage option is there for battery? What size of condenser is needed with each type or size of coil?

Is there a way too add a transistor for better operation? Any & all data will be welcome. Thanks, Capt,n
 
Hello Capt,n John You have good looking Wall 4 flat head 50 cc 1.00 bore 1.00 stroke egine. You have good wiring diagram, all I use for a condenser is what I get at an auto store. I use 6 volt ignition for all my model boats, been doing the same for over 55 yr's , to lazy to change. Somthing you might look at is model 5 ft 32 lbs boat with Wall 4 that I built in 1957 and the boat and I launched in 1958. been running this model pertty regularly though the yr's, gave it a ring job in 2009 and messed around with stuff, I should have left alone dumb. Back to somthing to look at go to RC Groups.com , then go to boats there is thead named video under the heading redcrafmodels there is video of the model runnig. you will see it starts very easy. Oh by the way the coil is a Lucas I went to that size and make because if I bought 12 at a time thay were only 12.75 ea 55 + yr's ago, I have a no. of them thay all work still, I do not think Lucas made them just labeled them, just a thougt. Regards Red [email protected]
 
Red, thank you very much for the help. I could not find the video you talked about. A direct link would help...email it to the private email system. I sure would like a Lucas coil if they are not too big. What are the coils used for in normal engines? Thanks Capt,n John Hesperia Michigan.
 
Hello Capt,n John This is along way around, dial though all the air craft untilt you get to boats then go to Dock Talk then go to page 2 it will say video by redcraftmodels about the 3d line it will say go to page 9 ahhhh, hope this will work Regards Red
 
I am not good with the crystal set either....never found the video. Thanks for helping me though. Best Regards, Capt,n:wall:
 
Thanks guys for all the help. I have the engine running now. I used a Model-electric coil and use 3 large NiCad batteries to power it. It took a little learning cure to fine tune it, but she sure runs great now. I do not use the rope start at all a good flip with the flywheel...and she is purring! I really like the sound of this engine. It has no oil leaks except by the inspection covers that use no gaskets. I will post more photos and a link to it running as soon as I can. Today off to a engine show in South Haven Mich.Thm:
 
As above in the last photo, I have the throttle linkage in place I made. The wall engine really runs much better when you throttle up. The advance is right in sync with the throttle. May be the first 4 cyl Wall engine with this feature!!! It is a delight too run. Best Regards, Capt,n
 
Hello Capt,n John Good to hear you have you'r Wall runnig. Let see if I can get you to the video I told you about, when you click on the RC groups go to page 4 in the upper right coner then scroal down to the bottom of the page you will see video by redcraftmodels and to the right you will see the mans name that made the video KMOT click on this line this will get you to the page that has the info to get you to the page that has line 9, then scroal down and click on line 9. I'm so dumb at this, any body can make this easer to get Cap,n John to this video JUMP IN. Regards Red
 
Go to the web page where this data is. Right click on the webpage bar at top & copy that web page address. Then in a new post too me...paste that address you copied. That will provide me a link to that page. Give it a go. Thanks

Capt,n
 
Below is some data...reasons why to use a transistor ignition. It is a copy & paste article.

HOW TO BUILD TRANSISTOR IGNITION MODULES
"Most carburetor problems are electrical" That was told to me by a savvy old auto mechanic long ago and it has proven true more times than I can remember.

The standard Kettering points/condenser ignition timing setup works just fine if the point faces are parallel and clean, are closed with proper pressure, and the condenser (capacitor is the current term) is good and of the correct value. A lot of ifs, don't you think? Also, unfortunately for us model engine builders, either a grossly oversize points/condenser set from older style lawn mower engines must be used or a miniature points set will have to be fabricated from questionable materials and with questionable accuracy. Most model engines don't have shaft oil seals and just a little oil leakage onto the points will cause major problems. Ever wonder why so many model gas engines on display at shows are never ran? Do you suppose it's because they are easy starters and good runners? Some may be. But how many really otherwise great engines won't run or are so hard to start because of ignition problems, that the owner won't even bother? What a shame! If you don't like having your engines ending up as just shelf models, then keep reading!

I came across the answer some years ago in a magazine article written by Floyd Carter and all my spark plug ignition model gas engines use it with great results. The original Transistor Ignition Module (TIM - 4) is a simple two transistor circuit that can easily be home built. TIM-4 was designed to operate on 3.6 volts (three Ni-Cad cells in series) for use with model airplane engines. It eliminates all the problems of standard points systems. The coil will give a good hot spark every time. The circuit requires very little current to trigger (25 ma). This allows use of a tiny micro switch for the points which can be easily hidden. There is no arcing, so the contacts in the micro switch will never burn. If you want your model antique engine to be authentic, or on already built engines which you don't want to change, the old point set can be used if desired. A "condenser" is not needed but can be included for looks.

And now for the really BIG advantage........ Since we now have a circuit that is so easy to trigger, we can use a tiny magnetic sensor instead of mechanical point contacts (high amperage switch)! The magnetic sensor is called a "Hall Effect Device". They are really tiny, measuring just .125" x .170" x .060" thick (3mm x 4.3mm x 1.52mm). Instead of a cam to operate contacts, a tiny magnet (only 1/8" diameter by 1/16" thick - or smaller) mounted on a drum or disk (cam gear) triggers the Hall device which is mounted in close proximity. The Hall sensor is located remote from the circuit board which can be hidden under the engine, or wherever you wish. Now you have the ultimate in small and reliable ignition, no mechanical parts, rub blocks or contact points at all! The circuits are extremely reliable.
 

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