Yes, there's a nut here that put a nut on a valve. And I can't remember the thread, but not long ago a fella had a bad experience with a threaded valve stem on a Fuller & Johnson model. And one would also think that we would learn from our and others mistakes, BUT. Well my thoughts here is to use the nut as a fine adjustment for the intake spring. Then I'll drill a small hole through and tie together with a safety wire.
Economy build.
- Thread starter CMS
- Start date
Help Support Home Model Engine Machinist Forum:
Got the governor weights and paws roughed in and I was test fitting everything to the shaft, looking good. Put the shaft in the engine, then it hit me!! Well it hit the crankshaft, the governor fly weights, that is!!
After a bit of thought, I decided to remove some of the excess metal on the throw of the crank, about .080". This gave the needed room to allow the governor shaft to rotate, but leaves VERY little room for the weights to move as the speed changes.
As of now the options that I'm thinking about are
#1, removing more from the crank throw
#2, cutting a steeper angle on the throw, ( see pictures )
#3, little bit of #1 and #2
#4, redesign/modify the fly weights.
Any thoughts or extra opinions??
After a bit of thought, I decided to remove some of the excess metal on the throw of the crank, about .080". This gave the needed room to allow the governor shaft to rotate, but leaves VERY little room for the weights to move as the speed changes.
As of now the options that I'm thinking about are
#1, removing more from the crank throw
#2, cutting a steeper angle on the throw, ( see pictures )
#3, little bit of #1 and #2
#4, redesign/modify the fly weights.
Any thoughts or extra opinions??
CMS;
Just my 2 cents. I have found that intake valve spring tension isn't that critical. Usually I just use a spring that lightly holds the valve shut. Doesn't seem to make much difference at the speed these engines run. A bag of springs from a surplus store yields an amazing variety of choices for $5.00. Lots of early engines used threaded valve stems and nuts but a cotter is a must.
The governor weights? a miss is as good as a mile.
Peter
Just my 2 cents. I have found that intake valve spring tension isn't that critical. Usually I just use a spring that lightly holds the valve shut. Doesn't seem to make much difference at the speed these engines run. A bag of springs from a surplus store yields an amazing variety of choices for $5.00. Lots of early engines used threaded valve stems and nuts but a cotter is a must.
The governor weights? a miss is as good as a mile.
Peter
Thanks for the input catminer, I'm thinking of the same pin and keeper setup that's on the exhaust valve, think it'll be the safest bet. I also chose to remove material from the side of the throw of the crank. I increased the angle from 4* to 8* and removed about .075". Still looks ok and I think the crank should still have enough meat to hold up. The offside hasn't been cut in the picture to show the new vs. the old profile. Hope this will be enough to keep the weights from hitting the crank when they fly outward from centrifugal force. Going to be close.
Problem solved and corrected!!! Both sides of crank have been reangled and a total of .080" removed. Got the governor shaft cut to length, and the grease cup installed on the connecting rod. Have located some 2-56 hardware at a hardware store about 35 miles from me, so a small trip is in store for tomorrow. Then I'll be able to mount the latch-out dogs on the connecting rod and the latch-out arm. Getting closer and closer!!!
A few more items to check off the list, got the latch-out dogs made and installed on the latch-out arm and the connecting rod. Also got a few spark plugs made. The plugs were made from 5/16 hex for the body with 1/4-32 threads, some UHMW???? as the insulator , and a piece of 1/16 s/s welding filler rod as the electrode.
Chipped away at the Economy a bit more this morning before work and a bit tonight. Got the speed adjustment arm made up and working and got the cam for the ignition points made. Tested the governor out tonight using a cordless drill to spin the engine over while holding the intake valve open, and it worked nicely. My drill is a two speed unit and low speed is 0-650 rpm. The latch out kicked in just before max speed of drill in low gear with the engines speed adjuster set to low speed.
Will pick up a set of points tomorrow for the ignition and who knows, might be able to shoot a bit of gas to it and here a put-put. Still need to make the exhaust pipe, also think I'm going to mount the engine on a cart so I'll need to make that too. Getting closer and closer!!!!
Will pick up a set of points tomorrow for the ignition and who knows, might be able to shoot a bit of gas to it and here a put-put. Still need to make the exhaust pipe, also think I'm going to mount the engine on a cart so I'll need to make that too. Getting closer and closer!!!!
Bought a set of points today and got that mounted and timed up. Hooked a temporary gas tank up, my hot-box, give it a few spins using a drill. Well I did get a few hits out of it but the exhaust valve started leaking by, drew in too much gas which washed the oil from the cylinder walls, further killing the compression. Sometime later on I'll be re-lapping the valves to their seats, and being a bit easier on the gas. I did notice a few small bubbles around the head during the compression stroke, may need a thin head gasket too.
This will be the fun part, tear-down, inspect, & rebuild
This will be the fun part, tear-down, inspect, & rebuild
Didn't get to do anything to the Economy this weekend, but I did have a 10HP Fuller & Johnson, full size that is, follow me home from up North. Shot a few pictures from our stop at the Strasburg Railroad. Last shot is from the train. Had a good time with the family.
Seems that a compression ring issue has got me. The rings that came with the kit fit really tight and have terrible drag, yet have about .012" ring gap. I tried a trick that some hot-roders told me, compress the ring and heat it up with a torch and it would take some of the spring out. Well the tip worked but I still have lots of drag and little to no compression. Before I give up on cast iron rings, and go with the viaton o-ring route, any pointers/info out there on making my own rings?
- Joined
- May 14, 2011
- Messages
- 683
- Reaction score
- 185
Try bluing the cyl. then put the ring in the cyl. alone use the piston to move the ring up and down if you can make this work you will see were their is drag and if the cyl. or rings are true. Dale
- Joined
- Jul 16, 2007
- Messages
- 2,985
- Reaction score
- 1,052
Hi CMS,
First of all as for the bubbles around the head area you are definitely going to need a head gasket. You are probably not losing much compression through the head/cylinder surface but a gasket will help. Gas is so thin that it will squeeze through the smallest of gaps.
Second, I make most of my rings the by the Trimble method. I find that they work very well but it's time consuming to just make one ring. Rather than fool with making your own why not just purchase one? There are several suppliers who sell rings of good quality.
gbritnell
First of all as for the bubbles around the head area you are definitely going to need a head gasket. You are probably not losing much compression through the head/cylinder surface but a gasket will help. Gas is so thin that it will squeeze through the smallest of gaps.
Second, I make most of my rings the by the Trimble method. I find that they work very well but it's time consuming to just make one ring. Rather than fool with making your own why not just purchase one? There are several suppliers who sell rings of good quality.
gbritnell
Thanks for the input GB. I honed the cylinder somemore today and have managed to get it to hit some on it's own, not for long, but it's slowly getting better. Didn't think ring break-in would be this much trouble, good thing for the drill.
Thanks guys, hope to have a more complete picture/video of it soon. Now I've had some thoughts on the paint, and everybody and their brothers has an Economy that's in the red flavor. And seems that everyone wants their model all shiny with pollished flywheels and a slick paint job, and that's ok.
Well I'm thinking about that rusty, dirty, aged look. Think I've seen some rust color paint by Rust-Oleum at Lowes or Tractor Supply. And I've also been looking at a kit called "Rust n Dust" from the Micro-Mark Co. Really like the appearance that this Rust n Dust has, per the pictures, but not sure how it would hold up to the gas and oils. Think I'll shot Micro-Mark a question about that.
Now a question to those that may breeze through here, what have you seen or done to get an old, dirty, aged look? Besides pissing somebody off;-)
Well I'm thinking about that rusty, dirty, aged look. Think I've seen some rust color paint by Rust-Oleum at Lowes or Tractor Supply. And I've also been looking at a kit called "Rust n Dust" from the Micro-Mark Co. Really like the appearance that this Rust n Dust has, per the pictures, but not sure how it would hold up to the gas and oils. Think I'll shot Micro-Mark a question about that.
Now a question to those that may breeze through here, what have you seen or done to get an old, dirty, aged look? Besides pissing somebody off;-)
