South Bend 8K photos

[mikbul]

Just to clear up my earlier recommendation for the Tormach OXA size quick change toolholder I had left over with all the tooling from my Micromark 7X16. It bolts right on but if I didn't already have one I would go a size bigger. I use the tool holder that came with the lathe for steel and the cutoff tool otherwise it will flex. It's a Pita but hate to loose the $ I paid for the OXA. Maybe at some point someone will buy the set and I'll upgrade.
Mikbul

 

[tlfamm]

(My inaugural post, 5 years after joining)

I've been alternately fascinated at the resiliency and persistence of the OP, and sometimes annoyed at the uneven support provided by Grizzly to new owners of the SB1001. The machine has caught my attention, and I've given some consideration to purchasing one, but haven't made a decision.



I've been a Grizzly customer for 5 years, generally satisfied with the in-warranty support I've had. But I did want to pass on one thing I've learned:


Grizzly, "Purveyor of Fine Machinery" has no stated "sunset policy". When a product is withdrawn from the market, for how long will they provide support and parts to existing customers?


Five years ago I purchased a Grizzly RF45 clone (G0480). I had some warranty issues in the first few months, but Grizzly provided the parts and I was satisfied.


Between five and eight months after my purchase, Grizzly dropped the machine from their lineup. In an email to Grizzly support I inquired about the future availability of support and parts. I'll summarize the answer succinctly:


The existing parts inventory for the G0480 will be allowed to self-extinguish, and there will be no future support or parts.


In hindsite, I developed a suspicion that there never had been a substantial parts inventory for that model:

1. Grizzly told me (in veiled terms) that the relationship with the manufacturer had been unsatisfactory from the get-go, and that is why the G0480 was dropped.

2. I had a vague suspicion that the parts provided to me were stripped from a floor model, as an apparently "as-is" G0480 appeared on an "Outlet" page on the web site, after the G0480 was dropped from the product line.

3. From memory, I think the G0480 was sold by Grizzly for less than three years - given a bad relationship with the manufacturer, how large a parts inventory could/would have been established to begin with?

===================================================================

The South Bend model SB1001 is in "closeout" status. What kind of support and parts inventory will Grizzly be providing, and for how long?

 

[Stieglitz]

Hi Mikbul,
Thanks for sharing a great looking lathe you have there.I can only drool as I look at my 1968 model Myford that is in a state of resurrection.
Cheers.

 

[tlfamm]

Just to clear up my earlier recommendation for the Tormach OXA size quick change toolholder I had left over with all the tooling from my Micromark 7X16. It bolts right on but if I didn't already have one I would go a size bigger. I use the tool holder that came with the lathe for steel and the cutoff tool otherwise it will flex. It's a Pita but hate to loose the $ I paid for the OXA. Maybe at some point someone will buy the set and I'll upgrade.
Mikbul

Here's an owner who did add an axa QCTP to his SB1001:

http://kent-vandervelden.blogspot.com/2013/11/aloris-axa-on-south-bend-sb1001-lathe.html


The compound has to be milled, and it's questionable whether or not there is really enough meat on it to anchor the mounting stud.

 

[deek]

Well, I just got my Aloris MXA QCTP a couple of days ago. Aloris is having a pretty good sale on a set.

I have to say the fit and finish is outstanding. I originally purchased and OXA from LMS. It worked, but I had trouble keeping it tightened down. It was about 1/2 the cost of the discounted Aloris, but I have to say I'd gladly pay for the Aloris again.

The Aloris grabs the tool holder tightly. The worm mechanism is smooth and tight. Everything moves smoothly. The screws for holding the tool piece are beefier than the one I had. In fact, everything is beefier on the Aloris.

The MXA requires either that you bore the post hole to accommodate the metric post or that you replace the post with the 3/8 variety. I elected to bore the post hole.

Remove the post sleeve from the tool and chuck it in the lathe. Then bore and ream. I reamed to .4009. I measured the post at .4002. It seems to fit nicely.

When I need to adjust the angle of the post, it tightens down nicely and stays put.

On past posts with warranty issues: Griz sent out a quill lock. I polished the quill and quill housing, cleaned everything up, and reinstalled the quill on the tailstock. Works fine. I got a piece of brass. I think I'm going to replace the cast lock with a brass one, but I've got a couple of other small projects ahead of it.

Peace

 

[mikbul]

I just dropped in to see what was going on and thank anyone for their response, sorry it took so long. Deek it sounds like you've got things hashed out to your liking and my SB1001 is still working nicely.
Mikbul

 

[mikbul]

Here's an updated list:

 

[chester179]

Interesting thread and thanks for posting . My impression is that it seems like there are manafacturing issues traceable to Taiwan but overall Grizzly seem to have responded pretty well in terms of customer support , especially considering its a heavily discounted relatively low budget lathe.
2 questions - are the roller bearings better than shell bearings or direct machined headstock type bearings.
And on page 19 you say the "standard races were junk" , do you mean they were destroyed (junked) by the lubrication failure that you suffered or that the originally fitted races are just simply junk.

 

[mikbul]

The replacement bearings Grizzly sent me were made in India (ZNL) and were inferior in manufacture. The OEM bearings were standard auto transmission bearings so I purchased some FAG German made bearings as an upgrade since it was apart.
Mikbul

 

[mikbul]

BTW you can go down to NAPA and purchase SDK replacement bearings made in Brazil which will work just fine if you don't want to spring for the FAG's.
Mikbul

 

[tlfamm]

The replacement bearings Grizzly sent me were made in India (ZNL) and were inferior in manufacture. The OEM bearings were standard auto transmission bearings so I purchased some FAG German made bearings as an upgrade since it was apart.
Mikbul

If I'm interpreting your post correctly, the replacement bearings sent by Grizzly were inferior to the auto transmission bearings the machine was originally equipped with? So the replacement bearings would be what - rickshaw bearings?

Doesn't this answer the question I posed previously:

-->The South Bend model SB1001 is in "closeout" status. What kind of support and parts inventory will Grizzly be providing, and for how long?<--

 

[mikbul]

Like I said in my previous post these bearings are a common # and used for hundreds of applications at $20-$30.00 a set so at the reduced price not an issue. For a home shop I wouldn't loose sleep. For production buy the 10K.

 

[Bowman]

Greetings, I registered because of this thread and would like to add to the pile. I was desperate for a small lathe with quickchange chuck as I go between 3 and 4-jaw in my work. Based on the first 50 or so postings this lathe seemed like a no brainer and I ordered it, without reading further

Lathe SN# SB1001-1151, shipped out of PA.

I haven't run the lathe, or broken into the bearings quite yet, but that will obviously happen. The attached photo shows the first order of business with tech support, the spindle nose. I'll let you know how this unfolds...

 

[Swifty]

How could a lathe with a spindle nose like that even leave the factory, absolutely no quality control.

Paul.

 

[Wizard69]

That is pathetic!

I kinda doubt Grizzly will be dealing with the company that built these lathes anymore.

 

[Bowman]

It was a bit of a shock unboxing it to discover this. Measuring the runout on the spindle, my measurement came out a factor of 6 off from the certificate that was included!!!! It leads me to believe that perhaps someone robbed Peter to pay Paul somewhere along the line... but that's just just speculation. The other problem that is not a surprise, now that I've worked my way through this thread, are the gear change pulleys that are too tight to fit onto the sleeves, and all the grit that had to be cleaned out of everything when it was de-greased (why is it that they can't clean and properly lubricate their parts before assembly like the rest of the world???).

If I don't get prompt attention from Grizzly to fix this, I'll have no choice but to return it. I just don't have the luxury of down time. Wish me luck.

 

[Wizard69]

It was a bit of a shock unboxing it to discover this. Measuring the runout on the spindle, my measurement came out a factor of 6 off from the certificate that was included!!!! It leads me to believe that perhaps someone robbed Peter to pay Paul somewhere along the line... but that's just just speculation. The other problem that is not a surprise, now that I've worked my way through this thread, are the gear change pulleys that are too tight to fit onto the sleeves, and all the grit that had to be cleaned out of everything when it was de-greased (why is it that they can't clean and properly lubricate their parts before assembly like the rest of the world???).



If I don't get prompt attention from Grizzly to fix this, I'll have no choice but to return it. I just don't have the luxury of down time. Wish me luck.

Hopefully thus is resolved quickly. This is a massive shame in that the lathe is well designed and as such has great potential. There really isn't a small lather out there right now that came close to what this one is. Or maybe I should say could have been. I have a feel Grizzly got promised a jewel of a lathe from a company that simply couldn't deliver.

 

[tlfamm]

...
I have a feel Grizzly got promised a jewel of a lathe from a company that simply couldn't deliver.

Frequently Grizzly is just acting as a big-box retailer, selling whatever products the factory chooses to produce, sometimes with small scale Grizzly-designed enhancements. But in the case of the SB1001, Grizzly guided the whole product development from design to production, including choosing the producer. I do think that a "jewel" was promised - at least implicitly by putting the South Bend name on it - but if you want a real jewel of a lathe, then I think Taiwan production (at substantially higher costs) is mandatory. But, in essence, Grizzly can get whatever quality it wants and is willing to pay for.


Grizzly terminated the product because the designed-in price point was unsustainable in the market place - and this for a lathe produced in China. Higher cost Taiwan production would only have made the problem worse.


So, was the Chinese company unable to deliver some level of quality, or did Grizzly, in abandoning the product, inform the factory to produce the last batch(es) of lathes at lowest price possible - taking whatever quality hit might ensue?

Kudos to Grizzly for investing the money, time and effort to develop the machine. Sorry the economics didn't work. As to whether or not Grizzly has responsibly terminated the product line, that remains to be seen.


Good luck to poster/purchaser Bowman - I hope a quick resolution is forthcoming ...

 

[Wizard69]

Frequently Grizzly is just acting as a big-box retailer, selling whatever products the factory chooses to produce, sometimes with small scale Grizzly-designed enhancements. But in the case of the SB1001, Grizzly guided the whole product development from design to production, including choosing the producer. I do think that a "jewel" was promised - at least implicitly by putting the South Bend name on it - but if you want a real jewel of a lathe, then I think Taiwan production (at substantially higher costs) is mandatory. But, in essence, Grizzly can get whatever quality it wants and is willing to pay for.

This is more or less Meyer understanding, the lathe was custom designed for Grizzly. From the standpoint of design it is a really nice lathe, that of course can be completely undermined by poor manufacturing.

Grizzly terminated the product because the designed-in price point was unsustainable in the market place - and this for a lathe produced in China. Higher cost Taiwan production would only have made the problem worse.

Was it really terminated due to price? I really don't know but I was under the impression there was more to it than that.

So, was the Chinese company unable to deliver some level of quality, or did Grizzly, in abandoning the product, inform the factory to produce the last batch(es) of lathes at lowest price possible - taking whatever quality hit might ensue?

I suspect the factory was unable to deliver.

Kudos to Grizzly for investing the money, time and effort to develop the machine. Sorry the economics didn't work. As to whether or not Grizzly has responsibly terminated the product line, that remains to be seen.


Good luck to poster/purchaser Bowman - I hope a quick resolution is forthcoming ...

This is likely one of those things where we will never know the whole story. I was personally very impressed with the lathe in Grizzly's show room when it first came out. If it wasn't for the 9x20 I already have I probably would have been an owner.

 

[mikbul]

It was a bit of a shock unboxing it to discover this. Measuring the runout on the spindle, my measurement came out a factor of 6 off from the certificate that was included!!!! It leads me to believe that perhaps someone robbed Peter to pay Paul somewhere along the line... but that's just just speculation. The other problem that is not a surprise, now that I've worked my way through this thread, are the gear change pulleys that are too tight to fit onto the sleeves, and all the grit that had to be cleaned out of everything when it was de-greased (why is it that they can't clean and properly lubricate their parts before assembly like the rest of the world???).

If I don't get prompt attention from Grizzly to fix this, I'll have no choice but to return it. I just don't have the luxury of down time. Wish me luck.

Hello Bowman,
From your ser# I believe that lathe was built in 2011 like mine and most of the other problem units. If I can help let me know.
Mikbul

BTW that lathe is machined in the same factory in Taiwan as the 10K with German and Japanese machinery so that spindle nose is a mystery.
Mikbul