Temporary fix.

[BigBore]

Okey doke, here's the situation. Because of all of the excellent and freely given ideas, techniques, and examples of Modeling that have been shared here, I've got the heebie-jeebies to get started, now worse than ever. I am saving at maximum capacity to get a 10X or 11X lathe ($2000). This will probably take until April or so to achieve. Would it be completely insane to go ahead and pick up a 7X right now, just to get started turning something. After I get the larger lathe, would the 7X ever serve a purpose or would I probably want to just sell it as a "barely used" lathe. It would take an extra month or so to finish saving up for the larger lathe but I wouldn't be sitting here in a near, anxiety induced comatose state and break down while waiting. Are there "carry over" talents and skill sets that could be acquired or would the two experiences be totally alien to each other? I'd appreciate your honesty but I've probably got my mind 90% made up and am looking for any excuse to hang my hat on.

If you think that I'm not crazy (then you are crazy) what would be a good justification approach to take in picking out a starter/supplementary lathe?.

I'd truly would respect some honest opinions from either point of view but please don't make me cry.

Ed

 

[ksouers]

Ed,
I would recommend continue saving for the larger lathe. The 7x machines will certainly get you by and give decent service for several years, however, the main thing to understand is that they are basically just a kit. They are in no condition to go to work "right out of the box". They need considerable tuning up and cleaning up to be of any real use. I'm not trying to talk you out of the 7x (also known as a C2), just trying to warn you that even with the C2 you might not be making anything worthwhile for a couple weeks or so till you get all the kinks worked out.

Now, if you intention to get the C2 and use it for a couple years, then get the big machine, by all means. They are fun little lathes. I have one that compliments my 9x20. But it has had a lot of tweaking done to it, and I'm still doing it.

Just hang on, it's only a few weeks.

 

[ozzie46]

Check Grizzly out. 10 x 22, $1189.00 includes shipping.
http://grizzly.com/products/10-x-22-Bench-Top-Metal-Lathe/G0602
No affiliation. Just a customer.

Ron

 

[Twmaster]

As the former owner of a 7x10 I'd strongly suggest you invest your money elsewhere unless you are willing to do all the tweaks needed to get the thing to cut well. If you are keeping it for more than a little while then it may be a viable choice. Otherwise the 10x22 from Grizz appears to be a decnet machine. Some members here have them and like them.

Less than $1200 to your door sounds like a good deal too.

 

[Cedge]

Ed
If you're that close to making the buy on the larger machines, keep saving and forget about the C2. Buy yourself a big bottle of Jack Daniels to calm your nerves and to re-enforce the comatose state for just a wee bit longer.

I used the C2 for quite a while and I can tell you that you'd hardly have the required tweaks made before the other machine took over your attention. My little C2 now sits in the way until some second operation situation arises. I've probably used it twice since the new C4 arrived.

Mine served me well, but I soon outgrew it's limitations even though it was still teaching me new tricks right up to the day I replaced it. 7X12 lathes can be great if that is all you can swing for, but I'd be saving my money for the tooling you're going to be buying instead. The cost of tooling up always catches you by surprise..... trust me on that one....LOL

Steve

 

[ozzie46]

As the former owner of a 7x10 I'd strongly suggest you invest your money elsewhere unless you are willing to do all the tweaks needed to get the thing to cut well. If you are keeping it for more than a little while then it may be a viable choice. Otherwise the 10x22 from Grizz appears to be a decnet machine. Some members here have them and like them.

Less than $1200 to your door sounds like a good deal too.

Uumm. Not quite to the door. Lift gate service to the door is extra.The shipping is to nearest trucking terminal. You can then pick it up there or pay for lift gate to you door. The 10 X 22 is about 450 or so lbs. Just got one in Oct.


Ron

 

[BigBore]

Check Grizzly out. 10 x 22, $1189.00 includes shipping.
http://grizzly.com/products/10-x-22-Bench-Top-Metal-Lathe/G0602
No affiliation. Just a customer.

Ron

I really appreciate the responses even though it's what I NEED to hear and not what I WANT to hear.

The G0602 is presently on the top of my "Yeah, that's the one" list. The G9972 also peaks my interest ( an 11 X 26 ). I really like the Weiss WM280V-F (11 X 27), on paper, but I can't get the USA distributor to answer an e-mail (3 in two weeks) That doesn't bode well to me. If he doesn't want my money why would he want to address a possible problem?

Thanks, gang, you are awesome. Have one on me. Tell 'em to put it on my tab. :

Ed

 

[rake60]

A 9 X 20 lathe is just about perfect for model engine building.
It can run fast enough to achieve a respectable finish on a 1/8" part
and swing 9" part with the appropriate cautions.

Take a look at the Harbor Freight offering.
Their customer support is ZERO and you don't get the worthless 4 jaw
chuck that the other vendors include, but it is the same lathe that many
of us own. "We don't need no stinkin customer support, we got HMEM."

Just food for thought.

Rick

 

[BigBore]

That's actually what I was thinking, Rick. HMEM has, no doubt, got the pants beat off of any customer support. The HF stuff is on my radar also.

I just want to play NOW but I know I would ultimately be better served by buying $500 worth of tooling and supplies and wait for the Big toy to show up. I'm just going to have to stop drooling on my keyboard until then. The Jack Daniels won't work because then I would just say, "Da Hek wid dis shid, dambit, I want my laffe now." Then I would do something stupid.

Ed

 

[rake60]

You are killing me here Ed!
Rof}

When I bought my 9 x "19" lathe from Grizzly,
(same machine WITH the useless 4 jaw chuck), I drove 4 hours to
a Grizzly outlet location. I paid for the lathe and backed up to the
loading dock door that I was told to go to. The fork lift driver came
driving happily around to that dock with my new lathe on the forks.
When he saw a Dodge Grand Caravan sitting there with the lift gate
open he said things that I'm pretty sure I was not intended to hear.
The dock supervisor quickly pointed out his indiscretions to him. LOL
He did a VERY good job of placing that crate over the rear axle of
my mini van. It took a couple attempts but I gave him a proper
tip for his extra efforts. It was kind of a wild 4 hour drive home with
that weight in the back of the Caravan. Then a buddy told me,
"Quit you wining, that was no worse than your two fat Aunt's in the back seat."
He may have been right, but I'm not telling ANY of my Aunt's about that comment!
:hDe:

Rick

 

[John Rudd]

A 9 X 20 lathe is just about perfect for model engine building.
It can run fast enough to achieve a respectable finish on a 1/8" part
and swing 9" part with the appropriate cautions.

Rick

Yeah , thats what I got...although my 9*20 came from Chester tools here in the UK...It has never disappointed me so far...

 

[ozzie46]

The 4 Jaw that comes with the Grizzly 10 X 22 is a proper 4 jaw and it is a 6 incher. At least mine is. You know your picking up something when you go to change chucks.

Apparently the ones for the 9 X 20 are more useful on wood. :big: :big: :big:

Ron

 

[vlmarshall]

Ah, good things to read in THIS thread. I'm hoping to get a 9x20 in a month or two.

Thank you all for the information.

 

[John Rudd]

The 4 Jaw that comes with the Grizzly 10 X 22 is a proper 4 jaw and it is a 6 incher.
Apparently the ones for the 9 X 20 are more useful on wood. :big: :big: :big:

Ron

Hmm the 4j that came with my 9*20 seems fine...Not that it has had much use...

 

[shred]

I started with a little Taig lathe, which is slightly less of a kit than the 7x, and still use it occasionally for little parts, but I wouldn't go buy one just for that now.

I've only seen the 10x22 once in person and never tried to move one, but is it something that can be put on a bench by a couple guys with some disassembly, or is an engine hoist going to be needed? The 11x and 12x sizes are certainly 'rigging required' type operations. Something else to consider...

 

[Metal Butcher]

Ed, Just to throw in my two cents worth.

I have the Enco 9x20 and have been totally satisfied with its quality and capacity. I compared other "brands" at the time and the only difference was a few add on's, like follow rest, 4-way tool post, turret,live center, just minor stuff that might be worth consideration when comparing prices.

If you "have to" buy a lathe "now" I would say that the extra cost of a 9x18 over the 7x is worth your consideration. The price difference will delay you purchase of the larger lathe by a few months more, or maybe even for a longer period of time. But it may end up being well worth the wait. You'll be so busy building engines with you new lathe that the time will pass quickly. Its also possible that you may change your mind altogether and find the 9x18 to be perfect for your needs, and further delay the larger lathe until a possibly "perceived" need becomes a "real" need.

Do you have a mill? A band saw? belt sander? etc. This would be another good reason to start out with the 9x18. I honestly doubt that if you still felt a need and got a larger lathe in the future, that you could part company with your 9x18. I can't say that about the 7x since I have never used or owned one.

I hope it doesn't sound like I'm trying to tell you what to do. I'm just thinking what I would do if in your situation. And my choice would (of course) be based on hind sight.

Opinions are like @.. ..... , every body has one. ;D

-MB

 

[ozzie46]

Yes rigging is required. Weight is about 450 lbs. I don't think it can be stripped enough for 2 guys to handle safely. I used rigging on mine with a neighbors help.

Ron

 

[BobWarfield]

Well, if you really want to take the plunge, what I would do is this:

- Buy a Harbor Freight 8"x12" lathe with 20% off coupon. These lathes are a lot more rigid than the 9x20's. They don't need the compound fix, for example.

- Buy an HF Sieg X2 with another 20% off coupon.

Now you have a lathe and a mill for a little under $1000 and you're ready to make some fine model engines. Save your dollars and buy a good sized lathe and mill down the road.

Cheers,

BW

 

[Bernd]

I'd like to add my 2¢ to the thread.

I have owned a Grizzly G4000 for over 10 years now. What I'm about to describe shouldn't apply to your decision to purchase a Grizzly lathe.

When I first set the lathe up I attempted to do some turning and promptly broke a few things. Mainly the bushings used on the gears. They were sintered metal and promptly sheared off the keys and one split in half. The reason for the bind was the worm wheel that gets driven off of the lead screw. The bracket that holds it all together was not milled square, plus the worm wheel was riding against the bare metal. No thrust washer was used. I fixed that to the best of my ability and carried on. At least I could turn down some round stock.

Next I tried threading. This was a total disaster. The finished threads looked terrible and a screw won't even screw on.

Now to side track a bit. I also own a Grizzly mini-mill. The quality of this machine is much better. But, I discovered that the lead screws are 16 threads per inch. I changed these over to 20 threads per inch. This lead me to investigate and see what the lead screw on the lathe is. Yup, 16 threads per inch. Now this is on a 10 year old machine. They may have up graded it. This was one reason I could never cut a decent single pointed thread.

The lathe is now totally torn apart for a rebuild. I'm going to change some things and make the machine more versatile. I just started on it about 2 months ago. Unfortunately it's one of many "round tuit" projects and hasn't been worked on in a while. I am keeping a build log over on Mad Modder about. Not much has been posted.

I've read were many people have asked bout the 4 jaw chucks that come with this lathe but haven't seen any pics of it. So I thought I'd post a couple of pics and show how bad one of these "old" chucks are. Below are four pics of my Grizzly 4 jaw. Notice the broken screw. That's what happens when you tighten the jaw to much. I'm still going to use that piece of equipment. It will make a nice custom face plate for when the machine is back up and running.

Remember what I said above about how old this machine is. I'm sure their quality has improve many fold over in the past 10 years. I also own several wood working machines and am quite happy with them. I believe Grizzly started out more of a wood working retailer than metal working.

I do have a Logan lathe that I'm quite happy with for turning larger items than the Grizzly could handle. I still want a lathe that has more swing than the Logan and will definitely get one if a larger domestic lathe doesn't cross my path first.

I hope this has been helpful info for some that own or are looking at buying a Grizzly lathe.

Regards,
Bernd

 

[jack.39]

Boiled down, it's simple: if we could predict the future, we could buy now with perfectly-made choices, right?

Try to search ahead in your mind whether you may eventually (in less than 10 years or so) want to build something on a scale larger than the smaller lathe choices will allow. If you are sure the answer is "no", buy smaller now.

Chance of bigger lathe need someday, buy bigger.

How "rigid" a lathe is remains rather subjective. One important factor determining "rigidity" is the size of the spindle bearings, and the size/type structure of the lathe's "bed".

If you have narrowed down the choices to let's say 2 lathes: investigate the hole size through the spindle. The bigger the bore hole, the bigger the spindle bearings, the more rigid the spindle will be when subjected to operating forces.

If you ever take the top cover off a truck transmission, like for example a New Process 4-speed with "granny gear", you will be surprised that the inside of that great big gear box is largely empty space, with rather puny-sized gears! Why? Because the supports are spaced far apart, for strength, limiting the "applied moment" similarly in concept to big spindle bearings in a lathe. jack