lancashire boiler HELP

[johnthomp]

can anyone out there please help me im looking for plans drawings or even just a photo or two of any model lancashire boiler
im seriously thinking of makeing one roughly 7" diametre and 16" length for a few reasons
first i have a fair few engines but have no boiler for them and if im gonna do something like this i might aswell do it big and bold
seacond reason is my grandfathers brother is an engineer and has been since 1949
bu is a little past it but says it can be done safely with the right guidance right at the moment he gave me an old leather folder wallet type file thingy with photographs of the firm his grandfather started and i believe is still in opperation to this day wich was called C H Thompson boiler works
according to the information in the folder the original C H Thompson developed the first prototype lancashire boiler in the mid 1800s the original drawings for tis boiler were so badly faded and rotten in this folder that they are all but completely illegible being ink drawn blueprints but there is a picture on my uncle tommys wall of his grandfather stood in a large industrial type room with a model of this boiler on the bench next to him and working it out off the picture i estimate its dimensions being roughly 7" by 16"
i have even gone as far as contacting the boiler firm to see if they have any archive information on this venture but they came back with the answer that it was true the boiler did exist and he did build it and made a hell of a lot of money off it but they couldnt find any documentation on this boiler in the way of drawings exept there were only one set of drawings ever drafted and 6 ofn this type of boiler were used on the building of titanic but i aint abbout to go to the wrecksite to see the damn things
can anyone help me please

 

[bearcar1]

Perhaps if you preview and research materials pertaining to the Titanic. I'm certain that I have seen drawings and specifications for the entire ship as well as the boilers and engine room. They may not have been complete from an engineering standpoint but architecturally they were accurate. If you could find these, it would give you good information to start.


BC1
Jim

 

[Dan Rowe]

I was not sure that type of boiler was under discussion so I found this on the web. There is a photo and a rough drawing.
http://www.mosi.org.uk/media/33871781/lancashireboiler.pdf

It seams that the Lancashire boiler had 2 furnace tubes. There were 29 boilers on the Titanic and 24 of these were double enders but all 29 had 3 furnace tubes. I do not know if that makes them another class of boilers or not.

Dan

Edit:
Found this photo of a mock up of a Titianic boiler front.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/nostri-imago/3279469678/

 

[johnthomp]

I was not sure that type of boiler was under discussion so I found this on the web. There is a photo and a rough drawing.
http://www.mosi.org.uk/media/33871781/lancashireboiler.pdf

It seams that the Lancashire boiler had 2 furnace tubes. There were 29 boilers on the Titanic and 24 of these were double enders but all 29 had 3 furnace tubes. I do not know if that makes them another class of boilers or not.

Dan

it seems to all known accounts to me that the third furnace tube was my great grandads original modification to the lancashire boiler but i wouldnt half enjoy trying to recreate such a monster

 

[Dan Rowe]

The books I have class the type of boiler used on the Titanic as Scotch boilers. This type is a bit shorter than the Lancashire boiler. The dimensions of the Titanic boilers are at the bottom of this page:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Scotch_marine_boiler

This page has front and side drawings of both types.
http://commons.wikimedia.org/wiki/C...Sketches_of_Engine_and_Machine_Details',_1918

Dan

 

[Kermit]

Here is a picture of a three furnace tube boiler from the previous link.

Kermit

 

[Maryak]

Hi Guys,

Titanics boilers were Marine return fire tube or Scotch boilers. As shown in Kermits diagrams.

A Lancashire boiler has no return tubes, the furnace tubes go all the way through the shell. The hot gas is then returned to the front of the boiler by brick dividers. The gas then passes to the rear of the boiler on the outsides of this central brick passage and on to the chimney. In each of the outside brick return passages a damper was fitted to control the draft which was induced through the boiler by the chimney.

AFAIK they were not used in ships.

I know I have a good picture somewhere but................................. ???

Hope this helps.

Best Regards
Bob

 

[johnthomp]

if the story of my great grandfather was a fake then so be it but id still love to build a miniature working lancashire boiler though or something that looks the part ive never built a boiler out of anything more than an old gas cylinder with a safety valve and just want to see if my brazeing riveting and metal forming skills are up to the test of makeing a good preassure vessel from scratch

 

[Dan Rowe]

Bob got it right the main difference between a Scotch boiler and a Lancashire boiler is the return flues. In a Scotch boiler the flue gas travels back to the boiler front via tubes above the furnace tubes.

The drawing of the Lancashire boiler linked above show the gas path in brick passages but no return flues. The addition of a third furnace tube on a large version would not change the gas path.

Dan

 

[lazyman]

Hi All

Interesting thread reminds me of my days at 'Crofton Beam Engines', what makes things confusing in the the pic that dan has posted is the fact that the return wall is not shown at the back of the boiler.

The correct route for the gas paths are from the firegrates #11 down the furnace tubes #13 where the arrow points under the boiler to #14 (that is the one that is directly underneath not the side flues) back down the side flues labeled #14, when the gas has done this it go's through an aperture in the wall where the dampers are, and up the flue to the chimney.
In some boiler plants their is usually a superheater and/or an economiser (feed water heater) at the end of the first pass, also at #10 there is sometimes a pair of cross tubes ( galloway tubes ) in each fire tube these also help in the water circulation.

I hope this has helped in the understanding of how a 'lanc boiler' works, I may have some pics or drgs somewhere, that need sorting out.

Lazyman

 

[lazyman]

Hmmm looks as though I need to get my glasses checked out, maryak has beaten me to it.

 

[johnthomp]

so in order to make a working model lancashire boiler i need some rather small model clay housebricks to build the main flues and house the main boiler shell this is gonna get messy but serving as a bricklayer for a few years would be verry interesting to do
anyone got any ideas where i can find clay dolls house bricks and the chemical based mortar there used to be a model shop in bury uk where i could get them but that place has shut down and long gone now and i dont feel up to the challenge of building a shrinking machine to alter real bricks but i do have the title dubbed to me by evryone round here the wythenshawe mad scientist for the things i do
has anyone ever seen these tiny bricks and knows where i can obtain them or do i have to start cutting bricks with the sthill saw and a diamond wheel?
IF ONLY I HAD THESE SKILLS 17 YEARS AGO

 

[Dan Rowe]

The best scale to find real bricks is 1:12. There are folks that make complete houses in this scale just like a real one. It is a very popular doll house scale in the UK. I model 1:13.7 which is 2' gauge on gauge 1 track, so a lot of 1:12 scale stuff is close enough for me.

A web search turned up this:
http://www.minaco-uk.com/page4.htm

Dan

 

[Dan Rowe]

I found a better drawing of a Lancashire boiler with a damper shown and a bit more detail in the written description.
http://twaintimes.net/boat/sbpage4b.html

Here is another link with photos of a boiler drum on the move, the firms name is the interesting bit.
http://www.localhistory.scit.wlv.ac.uk/Museum/Engineering/JohnThompson/johnthompson03.htm

Dan

 

[johnthomp]

The best scale to find real bricks is 1:12. There are folks that make complete houses in this scale just like a real one. It is a very popular doll house scale in the UK. I model 1:13.7 which is 2' gauge on gauge 1 track, so a lot of 1:12 scale stuff is close enough for me.

A web search turned up this:
http://www.minaco-uk.com/page4.htm

Dan

wow never mind buying the bricks im gonna get a brick makeing mold and not just build a boiler i can feel a really big project comeing on build the boiler then the engine room then the workshop and power plant and use it to power my missuses dolls houses **** i could build a village cheers for the amazeing link its a corker

 

[johnthomp]

I found a better drawing of a Lancashire boiler with a damper shown and a bit more detail in the written description.
http://twaintimes.net/boat/sbpage4b.html

Here is another link with photos of a boiler drum on the move, the firms name is the interesting bit.
http://www.localhistory.scit.wlv.ac.uk/Museum/Engineering/JohnThompson/johnthompson03.htm
that drawing of the boiler hasnt half cleared up all the little niggles i couldnt see or understand (its amazeing what a splash of colour can do) i seriously think its gonna be possible to build one of these things but im gonna have to save some serious cash to do it but for now i suppose i can get the ball rolling with getting the brick molds and starting that mammoth task
Dan