Help me buy a Mini Mill - Spindle Taper: MT #3 or R8?

[RMS]

Perhaps the most-purchased replacement part for the X2 would be the plastic gears driving the spindle. Eventually you'll turn on the mill with the locking pin (holds the spindle while you tighten) still in place and the plastic gears will break. The belt drive modification takes care of this problem. The plastic gears also contribute to most of the noise the mill makes when it is running. Bypassing the gears with the belt drive system quiets it down to almost a whisper. Every part for the X2 is sold by Little Machine Shop, as well as most of the modification hardware.

Nice, so I went looking at this belt drive conversion kit and one other thing I noticed besides having a nice and quite working environment was increased spindle speeds up to 4,300 and that seems like an added bonus for sure. Something to keep in mind down the road.

 

[don-tucker]

Hi Don,

Are there Warco dealers in the States? How much do these go for?

Thanks,
Rob

Don't know if there are any dealers in the US,in the UK they are £475 at the moment,but you can get it at a lower price,I think I paid under 400when I bought mine.
Don

 

[RMS]

One item I discovered that I don't think was mentioned but with the MT3 taper it matches my mini lathe, so I could use an ER25 Collet Set for both my new Milling Machines (not purchased yet) and my Lathe.

ER Collet Set for Milling Machines and Lathes

My next question would be what are the pros and cons on ER25 because at $78 this seems like a great buy.
http://www.micromark.com/ER25-COLLET-SET-MT3-SHANK,9731.html

An ER32 set seen here is $160 http://littlemachineshop.com/products/product_view.php?ProductID=2228&category=1963256902

 

[Andrew_D]

One item I discovered that I don't think was mentioned but with the MT3 taper it matches my mini lathe, so I could use an ER25 Collet Set for both my new Milling Machines (not purchased yet) and my Lathe.

I was just going to mention this....When shopping for my mini-mill, it was advertised as R8. I figured I'd just buy an R8 collet set (and other associated tooling). Briefly considered saving on the tooling and going with MT3 so I could use the tooling from my mini-lathe, but most of what I read spoke to the benefits of R8 over MT3. When I got the X2 home, I found out it was MT3...oh well

Now I'm glad it was MT3, as my new (to me) mill isn't R8...it's 45 taper!!

Andrew

 

[GOOFY063]

If you go with the harborfreight as I Thm: don't let them talk you into a 1 year replacement warranty, :wall: after all your work cleaning, fitting, and modifying your not going to want to let them have your labor of love. the standard warranty will replace what goes bad. I should have stuck with the standard warranty and saved that extra $$$$$ *bang*
this month will be a year and no trouble but the plastic gears. so i built a belt drive

 

[QSPSB]

I purchased a X2 from harbor freight last year and I'm very happy with it... I would suggest you convert it over to belt drive asap... them plastic gears wont last long... Not to mention the belt drive is super quite... I would also suggest you stiffen up the column as well.... The column on the X2 is the weak point on them... I did on mine and it is super rigid now... I can cut 1/4'' steel like it's butter... I have a few shots of it on my site if you care to look...

I'm currently converting it over to an CNC mill... But it will still be capable of being used manually... Via... Mini crank handles of the stepper motors.. as well as MPG/Jog on Mach3

As for spindle taper... H/F has an R8 taper... Go with an R8 taper if you can... There is much more tooling out there with an R8 taper than an MT taper... Not mention... R8 taper tooling is much cheaper and easier to come by..

My buddy has mastered the mini mill like no other... Check out his mods..
http://www.hossmachine.info/

http://www.quarterscaleprostreetberetta.com/My-CNC-Mill-.html
http://www.quarterscaleprostreetberetta.com/

 

[RMS]

I was just going to mention this....When shopping for my mini-mill, it was advertised as R8. I figured I'd just buy an R8 collet set (and other associated tooling). Briefly considered saving on the tooling and going with MT3 so I could use the tooling from my mini-lathe, but most of what I read spoke to the benefits of R8 over MT3. When I got the X2 home, I found out it was MT3...oh well

Now I'm glad it was MT3, as my new (to me) mill isn't R8...it's 45 taper!!

Andrew

I should not be too shocked, but I am kind of. Did it come from HF? How old is it? I was thinking of getting that one because of the R8........but now I am thinking about the Grizzly MT3 mini mill because its the cheapest one I can find. (low $$ funds) then I can afford some cheap initial tooling to get me going, and it will fit my lathe.


Rob

 

[Andrew_D]

I should not be too shocked, but I am kind of. Did it come from HF? How old is it? I was thinking of getting that one because of the R8........but now I am thinking about the Grizzly MT3 mini mill because its the cheapest one I can find. (low $$ funds) then I can afford some cheap initial tooling to get me going, and it will fit my lathe.


Rob

Sorry, no HF up here in The North...Princess Auto is our version...I picked it up a few years ago (3 maybe?)

No regrets on the purchase...I just have to remember not to over-tighten that MT3 taper...it can be a pig to undo...

Andrew

 

[winklmj]

If you want MT3--Grizzly and Micro-Mark are the only two I know about. Micro-Mark has their stuff on sale from time to time and you can get the old X2 in the low $500 range. Buy the time you add a belt-drive and air-spring it jumps back up again). I have the MM lathe and mill and have yet to use any MT3 tools between the two. About the only thing you could use is the collet set.

If you want an R8, the best deal is a HF with a 20% coupon. Use the saved money to add a belt drive, air-spring, and if you want--the Tru-Inch dials from MM. You can save some $$ by making your own belt drive--it's a fun project too.

Since $$$ is tight, I won't even mention the new X2 (with the brushless motor) from LMS--it already has a belt-drive and a larger-table.

 

[RMS]

Since $$$ is tight, I won't even mention the new X2 (with the brushless motor) from LMS--it already has a belt-drive and a larger-table.

That's OK; I been all over looking at these like a kid in a toy store! But I don't get why LMS only advertises that machines spindle speed at 100-2500 RPM; wouldn't the belt drive system include the high speed as well?

Anyways LMS does not have flat rate shipping so I would be looking at $225 extra just to ship it!! They say its just too heavy for UPS??? BUT Micro-Mark ships their mill UPS for a flat rate & Grizzly is flat rate also.

 

[RMS]

Sorry, no HF up here in The North...Princess Auto is our version...I picked it up a few years ago (3 maybe?)

No regrets on the purchase...I just have to remember not to over-tighten that MT3 taper...it can be a pig to undo...

Andrew

Hey Andrew,

This mill (x2) is expensive up in the North, $200 more than in the States here.
http://www.princessauto.com/workshop/garage/shop-power-tools/milling-machines/8145096-1/2-hp-milling-machine

 

[BMyers]

I have a LMS mini mill on it's way as we speak. I prefer R8 for the availability of tooling and variety of machines that have R8 spindles. I am eager to try out this little machine.

 

[RMS]

I have a LMS mini mill on it's way as we speak. I prefer R8 for the availability of tooling and variety of machines that have R8 spindles. I am eager to try out this little machine.

Let us know how you make out! and th_wwp

I am now considering a Shirline or a Taig Mill and I will be deciding on my purchase very soon! I guess I am now reevaluating and trying to decide what my needs and requirements are (small scale I am thinking) so maybe these USA made machines are something I should consider.

Man I hate all these choices because it starts to hurt my head! *club*

 

[BMyers]

Mill is here but as of yet I haven't got to use it. The spindle is bored wrong and it wont draw up my collets properly. So I am waiting for parts from LMS. Very disappointing to have to tear down and fix a new machine.

 

[RMS]

Mill is here but as of yet I haven't got to use it. The spindle is bored wrong and it wont draw up my collets properly. So I am waiting for parts from LMS. Very disappointing to have to tear down and fix a new machine.

Oh man I am sorry to hear that! Is LMS doing right by you in helping to correct this issue, who is paying to fix it? Because the way I see that is you paid good money for that machine!

th_bs th_wtf1

 

[BMyers]

LMS is shipping out new parts. I will let you know how it pans out.

 

[Tin Falcon]

RMS:

several threads back you asked for a comparison between the MM mil and the HF .
I purchased my X-2 in Oct 2001. we took a family trip to the Edison Workshop NHS in E. Orange then a side trip to the micromark show room. I was able to see the mill and accessories before I bought them. At the time their were not a lot of differences in between various models of x-2. over the last ten or so years various importers have orders improvements to the machines to address customer complaints.
MM advertises full technical support, easy to read manual, sub assembly packing for easy transport, and no messy red grease.
The main improvement I see to the r-8 version of the mill a a bigger motor 500w vs a 350w and a belt drive.
A belt drive conversion from LMS is $145. The MM version also has the air spring factory installed. so you are getting $175 worth of upgrades pre installed plus 50% more motor power.
An r-8 spindle kit from LMS is about $55 plus the cost of buying renting or making the tools to press the bearings in and out.
Hope this helps . see you are looking at Taig and Sherline good machines there as well. And made in USA so much the better.

Tin

 

[Philjoe5]

Just to muddy the waters a bit, there is another choice not mentioned here.
That is the new Grizzly G0704 mill/drill. It falls in between the X2 and X3 machines in weight at about 265 lb, has an R8 spindle, 1 hp variable speed motor and gear drive. It has less z axis travel than the X3 but more than the X2. It has more x and y axis travel than either the X2 or X3. It also has a few other features like rpm indicator and digital z axis indicator that I appreciate.

I own the Grizzly X3 and am completely satisfied with that machine. I recently bought the G0704 to replace a Harbor Freight X2 I owned for 5 years and with only a few days use with the new machine I'm satisfied with its performance.

With performance comes price though - $950. But as far as I can see, no upgrades will be needed.

Good luck in your decision.

Cheers,
Phil

 

[RMS]

RMS:

several threads back you asked for a comparison between the MM mil and the HF .
I purchased my X-2 in Oct 2001. we took a family trip to the Edison Workshop NHS in E. Orange then a side trip to the micromark show room. I was able to see the mill and accessories before I bought them. At the time their were not a lot of differences in between various models of x-2. over the last ten or so years various importers have orders improvements to the machines to address customer complaints.
MM advertises full technical support, easy to read manual, sub assembly packing for easy transport, and no messy red grease.
The main improvement I see to the r-8 version of the mill a a bigger motor 500w vs a 350w and a belt drive.
A belt drive conversion from LMS is $145. The MM version also has the air spring factory installed. so you are getting $175 worth of upgrades pre installed plus 50% more motor power.
An r-8 spindle kit from LMS is about $55 plus the cost of buying renting or making the tools to press the bearings in and out.
Hope this helps . see you are looking at Taig and Sherline good machines there as well. And made in USA so much the better.

Tin

Hey Tin,

I am almost ready to buy, but I recently started to also consider Taig and Shirline. Its crazy all the choices but I guess this is a good thing. Do you think this is a good deal for this Shirline:

http://cgi.ebay.com/Sherline-5400A-Deluxe-Mill-Package-w-1-4-Drill-Chuck-/220225336677?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item334673f565

Then I start thinking man if I am paying almost $1,000 on that then that G0704 from Grizzly starts to look good as well.

So I guess I need to decide on what my requirements really are and I really think they will me a mixed bag of small to med sized projects.

And yes I do think the Micro Mark R8 mill is the best deal due to shipping rate over the LM one (I am on the East Coast) If LM could adjust those and just ship UPS that would put them back in the game for me but both places offer some great stuff.

Rob

 

[RMS]

Just to muddy the waters a bit, there is another choice not mentioned here.
That is the new Grizzly G0704 mill/drill. It falls in between the X2 and X3 machines in weight at about 265 lb, has an R8 spindle, 1 hp variable speed motor and gear drive. It has less z axis travel than the X3 but more than the X2. It has more x and y axis travel than either the X2 or X3. It also has a few other features like rpm indicator and digital z axis indicator that I appreciate.

I own the Grizzly X3 and am completely satisfied with that machine. I recently bought the G0704 to replace a Harbor Freight X2 I owned for 5 years and with only a few days use with the new machine I'm satisfied with its performance.

With performance comes price though - $950. But as far as I can see, no upgrades will be needed.

Good luck in your decision.

Cheers,
Phil

Phil,

I like this one a lot myself! Looks like the quality of those polished metal hand wheels is a nice touch. I guess it is still fairly new offering?? Because the x axis is so long I am wondering how true it stays.

Rob