Easy at home Parkerizing steel and iron (US formula)

[jack404]

ZINC PHOSPHATE PARKERIZING

Parkerizing is a great way to protect your home made tools gadets etc from weather and wear (remember nothing gives 100% protection from neglect but it will slow the effects of exposure to rough conditions)

Phosphoric acid can be bought as a primer for bare metal. It is sold under the names
Ospho, Metal Prep, and Ph-ospho-ric and is a greenish liquid.

US FOLK Take 4 pennies, dated
1990 or later and drill small holes in them. US Pennies before this date are made of copper
and will not work!

Aussies Use the post 2002 or newer 20 cent peices UK FOLKS buggered if i know sorry

Heat up 8 oz. of the phosphoric acid in a microwaveable beaker or
cup. Drop the zinc disks (pennies, 2 bob bits etc) into the hot phosphoric acid. The coins will start
fizzing and leave them in for about 5 minutes. Remove the pennies from the acid.
SLOWLY transfer the liquid acid solution to a stainless steel container already containing
24 ozs of distilled water, and heat the solution up close to 190 degrees fahrenheit. Add
whatever steel object you want to parkerize and wait 10 – 20 minutes, depending on the
type of coating you are after. Experiment for different results.

NOTE: ALWAYS add acid to water, not water to acid, in order to prevent serious injury!

( it can jump back out at you faster than it went in!!!!)

cheers

jack

 

[ScottM]

you may be able to use zinc "cane" for stained glass.

- Scott

 

[tel]

Not fair really, is it? The Seppos get to do it for a penny - we gotta spend two bob.

I got about 200 litres of 100% food grade phosphoric on hand - I'll have to try that

 

[Kludge]

Thanks, Jack! This is more of the "kitchen chemistry" that is so absolutely cool. The Naval Jelly I used in one of my experiments has phosphoric acid as it's active ingredient but I suspect the other stuff would make it useless for this application.

How much of a range is there around the 190oF? I have a toaster oven dedicated to shop use (Almost had two of them but I caught myself in time ) but it's temperature holding capability isn't the best. Over the course of an hour it can swing 15-20oF without trying. The temperature setting is a good guess at where the center of that swing will be but it seems to be good enough for tempering steel.

Anyway, thanks again for the information!

BEst regards,

Kludge

 

[Kludge]

Not fair really, is it? The Seppos get to do it for a penny - we gotta spend two bob.

That just means yours is worth far more than ours. ;D

Best regards,

Kludge

 

[jack404]

hold on i goofed

i will have to check on something i get granulated zinc but was checking my mates notes about 2 bob bits and i think that may be wrong i remember he did a mi and it was lousy contamination the US tuff works i know a friend in AZ did it and it worked a treat i'll be back when i check the twenty cent peice part

cheers

jack

( i am thinking there is too much nickel for it to work)

back later

 

[jack404]

To clarify

The US formula works as stated

for Australia heres a beut!

the Captain Cook 1976 commemorative 20 cent peice is the only ones that works the rest wont they are cupro-nickel the CC one has so much zinc in it people where melting them down at one time it had 50 cents of zinc in it

they are so rare now due to this they are worth $2 at a coin dealers in good condition

but for the park job go to a boat shop and get some annode strip (zinc alloy) and put 2" of this cut into 1/4" bits into the formula and carry on as before

and sorry for the mix up i use granulated zinc and been useing the same 5 kilo bag i bought in 1970 my mate did use coins but .. we'll too many beers not enough details

got it sorted now

cheers

jack

 

[tel]

I haven't seen one o' them in redent years. Wonder if they still sell zinc flashing? Or how about that perforated sheet they used to use in the sides of meat safes?

 

[jack404]

that'd work Tel

but thats as rare as rocking horse manure ( those old meat safes are popular with the trendy fashionista's)

annode strip is zinc and alu alloy and is cheap the alu dont get effected by tha acid and dont mix in the solution

how far from town are you ?? ( Bathurst) trade ya some 100% granulated zinc for a a couple litres of phosphoric

but i'd come up on the train,

i have a mate up that way, i gotta drop some powder too some time and pick up some charcoal some time anyway, we meet at the pub and have a counter lunch before i waddle back to the train and sleep off lunch wanna join up?

cheers

jack

 

[tel]

OK mate, yer on. I'll decant some phos for you over the next few days.

I'm about 26 km out of town, but that's not a problem

Charcoal charcoal or willow charcoal?

 

[Bluechip]

Hi troops

AFAIK the outer can on a dry cell is fairly pure zinc -
Hence 'Zinc - Carbon' Battery.

Cannot say for 'Alkaline Batteries'

Dave

 

[jack404]

Willow he lives half way to Sofala and theres a heap of river willow by the creek on his place

its been collected a couple of years ago , stacked and dryed before coaling since i'm in a flat he coals it for me and i make powder from it and corm it which he has never been real good at. good charcoal and corming are the big secrets of BP..

26 k's if its a hassle say so eh.. and let me know whats a good day for you, i'm my own boss ( for now ) so any time is ok for me really

Dave the zinc in the older batteries has berrylium mixed with it and that goes gaseous as soon as its mixed with the acid ( mercuric oxides too but thats relatively new i think maybe i am wrong)

yes it will work but dont do it near anyones house and dont do it near grass critters will eat berrylium is nasty stuff other than that i know folks who use that and get very good results as its a oxidized form that breaks down and coats even better for some reason but because of the berrylium and mercuryoxide in some brands i dont personally use batteries or recommend them

too many gun nuts crook ( very sick) from doing that.

but they did not take precautions so if you DO TAKE PRECAUTIONS it should be ok

cheers

jack

 

[Macca]

wow Jack, I can't wait to try this, I'll pick up some stuff this afternoon and give it a go.
By my dodgy conversions it looks like 10 grams of zinc to 1 litre of acid/water, does that sound about right?
How much steel will the given solution coat?
What is the best way to dispose of the depleted solution?
Do you have any experience using manganese dioxide instead of zinc? Apparently it gives a darker gray/black finish which sounds like its more up my alley than the light gray/silver finish the zinc apparently gives.

 

[jack404]

Macca , go 12 grams per litre better too strong than too weak

but here are some tips

well and truly clean all metals first and then water wash and heat dry

use distilled water always chlorine and fluride are dangerous in anything that has acid

also do double check everything i say i am a amatuer ( been doing it a long time but some people never get the same results i do i dunno why)

also do a test run on some scrap before you go for expencive parts 3-4 attempts and times will give you a good idea what effects /temp/time you will get /need

i use the big hungarian pickle jars to hold the solutions in and get 6 months out of a batch

for disposal i use a lime pit out in the boonies but suggest you contact your council and ask them most have a good place to get rid of this and generally free, lime is not cheap neither is soda ash mix which is another one i use
but that way i KNOW ITS OK and generally good for the soil after its broken down ( if i have not screwed up)

in parking a rifle the weight you add to the rifle is about a gram total ( bugger all eh) so you get 12 from a batch before its all used,

i'll post some mang coated i did a refurbish on a Biakal ( Russian ) target pistol for a cop mate ( ex digger turned blue ) but the stuff you use with mang. is not nice and i prefer to have a good 40 acres paddock for Mang work ( or industrial extractors/filters that i have now, part time)


this is as he bought it not the rust marks and wear marks

and this is after i got to it this was a 11 minute soak in the solution and a bath in a mix of 20/40 motor oil and some diesal oil treatment then 4 hours in the oven to bake it then a water wash and a light hydrocloric (22% and distilled water mix to clean it

below is the formula i used with the cylinder oil substituted for the 20/40 (kmart cheapie cheaper the better as the expencive stuff has emulsifiers you dont want in it, used is better beleive it or not, then you dont need the diesal treatment)

the flash makes it lighter than it is so look at the recoil pin and block to guage it this is a light black 15 mins and its twice as black but not shiny untill its biffed with 4000 grade carberundum paste and a dremel

cheers

jack

 

[Macca]

Thats a nice finish on the pistol!
I did some reading today on parkerizing after your post, there is a method, with the same steps you have at the top here, but using manganese dioxide instead of zinc. (Looks to be about equal parts by volume of phosphoric acid and manganese dioxide.) Have you tried this method, or just the potassium nitrate/manganese dioxide one?
Hopefully I'll be able to have an experiment with some zinc later on tonight. Approximately what concentration is the acid you use? I picked up some rust converter that is about 60% acid, is this similar to your one?

 

[tel]

OK Jack, acid drawn off - got 'arf licked to death by a 'orse while I was doing it.

Generally either Thursdays or Fridays are best for me, usually pretty well tied up Mon thru Wed. Weekends it's almost impossible to predict, wot with 5 grandkids, 'orses, sheep, cows etc adding to the variables, plus the never ending getting of stove wood.

 

[jack404]

Macca,

i have never used the phosphoric with mang oxide

sorry

as for strength i'll let you know ( gotta read the label and its at the workshop i rent not the one here)

if its still readable ! its a very old lot i got when i was in adelaide

i think its food grade so think thats about 55-60% i dunno , tel? whats yours say if it does?

i do know i am almost out!!! hence the trade offer with tel ( cheers again for that!)

i like the potassium / mang oxide mix as it can be reused indefinatly just add a bit more mang oxide each time

actually i'm putting together a whole pile of gun stuff in partnership with a mate in the US

a 2 DVD set we hope to flog off

but i do hope you folks dont need to buy that as the old NRA gunsmithing guides and old copies of home gun smith are about still and have so many formulas it would take 3 life times to try them all

i stick with the mang/potassium nitrate, rust blue and zinc park as my main options for folks and customers

they work are reliable /repeatable safe and once set up dont cost a bomb

i'll dig up some of the old books i have here and post these in the download section for the members over the coming week

cheers

jack

tel your a ripper ! what say next thursday ? choose a pub and i'll shout ya a feed and a schooner or two to wash it down ( gotta head to the cop shop first to drop of the powder, booze, me and BP dont mix but thats no drama and only takes halfa a shake) none of this pasta yuppie stuff though!!! steak and taters is the G O
other than that choose a watering 'ole and let me know and i'll meet ya there

only drama is i gotta be back on the bus by 1.55 pm otherwise i'll be there until 6 and maggoted ( my drinking rate is still 3-4 schooies a hour) and they probably wont let me on the bus!!! bloody narks!!, PC doo goody two shoed wet arsed ( insert favouraite rant here)

cheers

 

[tel]

Dunno, the labels have long since washed off my drums, but 60% seems to ring a bell.

Steak & taters sounds good to me, but it's years since I ate in a Bx pub, so I got no idea - where do you usually go?

Did you mean Thur this week, or next?

I take it you'll be coming in on the XPT? 11 ish?

 

[jack404]

Tel i used to have a feed at tatt's but that shut a few years ago I'll ring my mate in the morning and get the name and addy of where we usually go could be the railway but i aint sure,

next week mate i'm chockers until about teusday (working the beastie below )

XPT!! your behind the times me old son, cutbacks! its a bus from lithgow now unless you do it monday weds saterday, and i aint so its "all change" at lithgow and hi ho bus we go

get in just after 12 drop me load pick up the coal and sling it to murph who loads it on the bus at the depot as freight while i toddle off for a feed and drink 2 hours in town and bugger off home again XPT gave me 4 hours in town but bus cuts it to 2

yeah labels phosphoric stuffs lables, its worse than wd40 and silica gel mixed

pics ( finally found the ones where its finished ) the flash still makes this look a lot lighter than it really is but you get the idea, recoating any metal is not that hard and gives it a new look

and someone asked me what a rifling lathe looks like its basically a big old pipe lathe with a multi head for cutting chambers and crowning and a through hole for the button reaming "T" rod and a seperate dual hydraulic ram ( at the 1 O'clock position above the collet in the pic another ram hidden at the 7 o'clock posi behind the tool arm) to drive the button ram swing arm

this one was made in 1942


and this is the "big" rented workshop ( its a workshop at a garage or gas station for the folks in the US)

it looks a lot bigger in the pic but the tall thing to the right of my bright yellow lathe is the "gun drill" a special drill with a hydraulic head and pump and a 4 foot travel i can drill a 47" deep hole as straight as a arrow in 3 hours, the blank 4130 bar is against the wall

 

[tel]

Next week will suit me fine - I'd have been a bit tight for time this week. I think the Railway is now the Chifley, and the Tatt's is now the Elephant and Castle.

Like the pics BTW - I'm impressed!