fittings, piping, mounting

[zeeprogrammer]

I now have two steam engines. I need to think about displaying them. (If they're good...people say 'ooh, aah'...if they're bad...it's a progression to 'ooh, aah'.) Right now I'm up to "that's neat...what do you do with them"?

Anyway...the idea is to mount them in such way that I can easily demonstrate them. Eventually though, the means to demonstrate them can also become 'points of interest'. For example, I've seen some references to 'wrapping in rope'. I imagine that has to do with insulation...but I don't know enough yet. In any case, detail adds interest.

My thinking is some kind of brass fitting on the engine. I've seen some neat things made from hex. Silver solder some copper piping to that. Route the pipe to the edge of the display. Silver solder some kind of fitting there. Attach (somehow) an air line to that.

I know nothing about silver soldering (well not nothing, but let's start with that) but I see it all the time on this forum.

Silver solder brass to copper?
How to specify the copper tubing? By OD? By ID?
Where to get it? Is Home Depot's copper suitable?

Don't assume an air compressor. Maybe hook up a boiler someday. Does that change the choice of copper? Of solder? Of modeler?

Common sizes of fittings? One engine uses a 3/16-40 thread, the other uses 8-32.

Tell me about the rope.
What about valves?

Favorite books on the subject?

In the meantime I have to lay my hands on a router and table. Figure out wood...finishes. I'm starting to realize a software engineer doesn't know a whole lot. Or at least...this little software engineer. (Not quite true...I've played with these things before...but that's just it...play.)

Thanks.

 

[IronHorse]

I like to use the 3/16" brass fittings and pipe from PM Research. I also run silicon tubing to a 5-gang air valve from a aquarium. This way I can run a number of engines from an air compressor and have control over each one.


IronHorse

 

[Cedge]

Carl
I go the fitting route on my engines for the same reasons you mention. The rope on the lines is not difficult and it does add a strong old world look to an engine for just a little bit of work. Cotton string is my material of choice. I tend to make my own fittings so size is usually dictated by the project at hand.

Silver soldering is used in joints exposed to high stress because of the strength of the solder joints. It really isn't required for every soldering job on a steam engine. I don't recommend plumbers solder....especially the current blends, but any hardware store will have what is known as "silver bearing" solder.

It has a low percentage of silver in the blend (usually 3 - 7 percent) , with higher silver content giving a harder joint and requiring higher torch temps to use it. It's perfect for joining small parts and sweating lines and fittings where the exposure to pressure is limited to a small physical surface area. You wouldn't want to us it in a boiler build but it's certainly safe for the small places you're describing. .

I've used it to solder steam chests to cylinders with out any problems, other than my messy technique making for some tough clean up work. It's also a butt load cheaper than true sliver solder

Steve

 

[tel]

I find the making of fittings to be one of the most enjoyable aspects of the hobby - very satisfying work. But I have to disagree with you Steve - you need the best 45% silver solder you can lay paws on.

 

[Tin Falcon]

Carl:
The fitting issues have pretty well been covered.
The wood bases do not need to be expensive or complicated. I have been fortunate to aqire nice scraps of cherry and oak. the oak from packing crates. I have yet to use a router for bases although it is on my wish list of tools somewhere. I know some would cringe at the thought but wood can be machined on a lathe and mill. Also for a bit richer but less traditional look you can use corian aka solid surface material for bases. Most display bases I have are rectangular but I have done octagon and round
Tin

 

[zeeprogrammer]

IronHorse: Thanks. Where do you get your silicon tubing?

Steve and Tel: Thanks. I'll check out the hardware store. It doesn't look like the chain stores carry that kind of solder.

Tin: Right. Forgot about corian.

I used to work for a company that made table top robots (and even small lathes!) for education. We had a few CNC mills and lathes. The owner was adamant about not milling/turning wood. He was afraid the chips would get into crevasses, expand due to soaking up oil or coolant, and take the machines out of true. I say he was 'afraid' because he never said it actually happened.

 

[b.lindsey]

Carl,
A good consistent source I find is in the "projects" boards sections of Lowe's. Home Depot, etc. They are often available in red oak or poplar, and maybe others. They are straight, clear, and available in convenient sizes/lengths. For ovals, I found some ready made as in the picture below in the section of the store where you find stair railings, banisters, etc. These are the pieces that you would mount to a wall typically and butt the end of the handrail up against. Not much choice of sizes but they were perfect for my needs...already cut to oval shape and routed, just need finishing.

Regards,

Bill

 

[hammers-n-nails]

zee
as a carpenter/cabinetmaker by trade i can tell you that makeing a wood base will be by far the easiest part of a build.as far as a router table goes,you dont need one,my dads machine shop started out as a cabinet with every woodworking tool you need and weve never had a need for a router table it would likely just take up space. i would highly reccomend a 1 3/4 hp porter cable that sells at lowes for $139.tin falcon is right it is totally possible to use a mill for wood and that might be the way to go so all youd have to buy is a router bit .packing crate lumber is mentioned in the previous post, i would discourage its use for this purpose for two reasons, one because it is air dried and will more than likely split in time, secondly because its ugly. and finally finishing is just a matter of sandin, staining-if you prefer-, and clearcoating. i probably over-answered your question but if you got more let me know.

 

[Kermit]

I like the look of marble. IF you want to spring for a box of 5 tiles. Go check out that section at LowDepot supermart. I was particularly drawn to a light black with some clear crystal quartz veins. Blinged up with simple brass edging it would make a beautiful base.

If you do spring for a router(not a bad choice in my opinion) get one with a 1/2" collet. They take adapters for all the smaller size bits and they fit in those aftermarket shaper stands. The ones with the router mounted upside down underneath. Sears has a good model that's not hard on the wallet.

Fabric stores carry ALL kinds of cotton thread, twine, yarn, etc. A simple watered down mixture of elmers white glue to soak the thread and then wrap, wrap, wrap. The glue trick is one I used all the time when rigging old ship models.

Use that imagination with a dabble of improvisation, along with a big helping of individuality. Can't go wrong with that mix.

Kermit

 

[zeeprogrammer]

Bill: Good idea. And nice engine.
hammers-n-nails: Shhhhh. Don't let my better half hear you. I was hoping for a router. ;D
Kermit: Also good idea.

Presentation is (almost) everything.

One of the things I like about this hobby is how my perception of what I see is changing...hm...how might I use that? or this? or that?

So...brass fittings and some piping. Copper? Brass? Is it just a matter of what I want? The look? I take it I can silver solder copper to brass. OD of tubing to get? Or rather...what goes into the decision as to what OD to get?

Yes...right now it's air. But someday...someday...I'll want to try a boiler. Why shouldn't I be able to hook these engines up to one?

 

[tel]

Yep, silver soldering copper to brass is not a problem. For tube you really need a selection on hand to cater for the job of the moment - 1/8", 3/16" and 1/4" are 'must haves', but you also want to grab hold of any 3/32", 5/32", 7/32" you come across. I also keep some 1/16" in copper and brass, as it's useful stuff as well.

Bits of bigger tubing are also handy to keep on hand - the rule is to grab up any you find and sock it away against the day when it will be needed.

 

[zeeprogrammer]

I also keep some 1/16" in copper and brass, as it's useful stuff as well.

Thanks tel.

1/16"!! I was surprised I could find 1/8". But now that I think about it...you can find that small kind of stuff at the hobby shop.

Thanks.

 

[AlanHaisley]

So...brass fittings and some piping. Copper? Brass? Is it just a matter of what I want? The look? I take it I can silver solder copper to brass. OD of tubing to get? Or rather...what goes into the decision as to what OD to get?
Yes...right now it's air. But someday...someday...I'll want to try a boiler. Why shouldn't I be able to hook these engines up to one?

Carl,

Copper, brass, bronze, and steel or iron all solder with each other. A lot of success depends on having enough heat but not too much, extreme cleanliness, a good flux (I only have cheap generic hardware store flux right now) - and practice, practice, ...

Aluminum, stainless, etc. are tricky, if possible at all for us novices so I don't even try. You'll probably hear from a bunch of people who do it successfully all the time though.

My local hardware stores all seem to carry the small plastic tubing. Also pet stores that sell aquaria will have a size or two.

Soldering small diameter copper tubing into a little brass or bronze elbow or tee should take very little heat. You do want to joint to be somewhat "wiggle" loose so there is a space for the solder to wick into.

Also, get some citric acid powder to make up a "pickling solution" to clean up the burn stains, excess soldering paste or fluid, and general discolorations that result from soldering. Lots of people recommend citric because, while it is acid, it is a safe one, like vinegar. (I don't know why no one seems to recommend white vinegar for this, they just don't seem to.)

Alan

 

[shred]

I've wandered by my local Woodcraft store when in need of a base-- they have a selection of exotic wood pre-cut that finishes up nicely. You'll need a router to make nice edges though

 

[hammers-n-nails]

nobody probably cares but here it is
[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XN5wv6XLq9s[/ame]

 

[zeeprogrammer]

Thanks Alan. I picked up some alum at the grocery store the other day. No other equipment/supplies yet....but I consider it a start!

Thanks Shred.

I care 'hammers-n-nails'. I'm sure you meant that as a demo of what could be done. With my luck I'd suddenly be playing 'air router'...the piece would be on the other side of the room. Seems work-able for the odd job.

 

[Dhow Nunda wallah]

Zee, just get a cheap 1/4" router and a slab of 1/2" or thicker, MDF.
Make a router table!
Screw or clamp (c'mon, you're a machinist) the router to the bottom of the MDF and chuck the largest bit you have.
Plunge said bit through the MDF, turn over, instant router table ready to clamp on bench edge.
You can nail/screw/hot glue any kind of fence or jig to the cheapo table.
Use bearing-guided moulding bits and you can get all those fancy edges without risking your workpiece OR YOUR FINGERS!

Don't forget that the router bit is doing 30-40 KRPM anticlockwise, climb cutting is a bad idea!
IE, reverse normal direction of feed.

Cheers,
Lin