How important is a mill?

[lazylathe]

Hi all!

I have been trying for some time now to build a small engine of sorts.
At first i only had round stock, so that was difficult.
I just messed around with perfecting the fit and polish of items.

I now have some different shapes of stock and thought i would give it a go!

After hack sawing a section off i reached a dilemma...
Two sides were good and flat, the other 2 sides needed some serious attention!
Out comes the file... It came out pretty good, but not good enough for me!

I think it is time to break down and get a mill.
Not too many options here in Canada.
Busy Bee Tools have Craftex and a place down the road sells Siegs for between $13 to $1600 Canadian.
Can also get a Sherline to match my lathe and as Vernon said get it tricked out with CNC at a later date.


But i digress... Is it possible to make an engine without a mill?
Also take into account this is my first metal lathe and i am very new to this!
Still reading everything i can!

ps. I did make a nice shiny steel centre punch today after putting away the engine ideas for now!

 

[mklotz]

Anything is possible (actually, everyone likes to say that but it's pure BS - only a few moments reflection and you should be able to come up with a dozen counterexamples), but building small engine models without a mill is roughly equivalent to trying to make a vat of 1982 Chateau Lafite Rothschild from grapes you grew yourself on that arbor that hides the septic tank in the backyard.

 

[lazylathe]

That is what i thought...
I have used the 4 jaw chuck for various things like drilling off centre holes and such.

But when i look at it from many angles and try to figure out how to face something so that all sides are parallel to each other
i come up stumped.
I know there are many accessories i can get to add onto my lathe to turn it into a milling machine,
but then comes the question of rigidity and accuracy. And having to reset everything once i change over from lathe to mill...

I will continue my quest to find a good quality mini mill here in Canada.
I do not have the space or funds for a large mill, so a mini mill it will have to be!

 

[tel]

Hmmmm..... I built two locomotives and about 14 stationary engines before I got a mill - had nothing but the Myford lathe and a small drill press in those days. Still, if you blokes say it can't be done who am I to argue

 

[vlmarshall]

A quick search online puts the invention of the metal-cutting lathe around 1751, and the milling machine around 1818... so, the REST of the world got along without a mill for 67 years... ;D

 

[Deanofid]

With just the lathe, you can certainly build an engine. The size of the engine will be dictated by the size of the lathe. Doing things like squaring up a block can be done with a face plate, angle plate, and clamps.
For your Sherline, a milling attachment will offer a third axis at a fairly low price, and it takes about five minutes to setup on the cross slide. A little planning will keep you from having to switch back and forth from turning to milling mode to a minimum.

If you have funds for a milling machine, it would be nice, but not having one shouldn't keep you from building small engines. You'll learn a lot using just a lathe too.

Dean

 

[Maryak]

LL,

Every ship I served in had a lathe, but only capital ships had extra's such as shapers, mills, power hacksaws, etc.

A mill makes life easy but is not essential. Things I would think nothing of in my youth such as hammers, chisels and files to reduce large flat surfaces are now in the too hard basket but it can be done very successfully.

Trade off between time and effort and dollars dosh.

Hope this helps

Best Regards
Bob

 

[Tin Falcon]

this part was done with a drill press band saw and file. yes a mill makes things easier and more precise.

BTW the author uses a lathe to do this part on his build not a mill.
Tin

 

[Blogwitch]

Look at the first pic, it is a representation of a lathe fitted with a vertical slide.

Now look at the second, and think what it looks like.

A lathe can be used effectively as a small mill very easily.


Blogs

 

[doc1955]

I totally agree mills only make life easier but you can do most anything that needs to be done with a lathe.

LL,

Every ship I served in had a lathe, but only capital ships had extra's such as shapers, mills, power hacksaws, etc.

A mill makes life easy but is not essential. Things I would think nothing of in my youth such as hammers, chisels and files to reduce large flat surfaces are now in the too hard basket but it can be done very successfully.

Trade off between time and effort and dollars dosh.

Hope this helps

Best Regards
Bob

 

[lazylathe]

so, the REST of the world got along without a mill for 67 years... ;D

LOL! Too true!
But how many of you lathe and mill wielding machinists would give up their mill now?

I know i have asked a lot of questions about the value of having a stand alone mill...
I am trying to sort out if i want to get an add on for the lathe, a cheaper option.
Or just go the whole hog and get a stand alone mill.

Blogwitch i know what you are saying, add ons are great!

Tin Falcon, no drill press here, the mill would also function as one.

Tel, like i said i have just started out. Still need to figure a lot of things out by myself! I am not an engineer nor do i work with these tools on a daily basis. I make teeth for people, so i have access to smaller machines and motors. Just starting out on a lathe...
Only been about a month so far!

 

[Deanofid]

LOL! Too true!
But how many of you lathe and mill wielding machinists would give up their mill now?

I wouldn't just give it away on a whim, but if my lathe and mill were just suddenly missing, the first I would replace would be the lathe.

I know i have asked a lot of questions about the value of having a stand alone mill...
I am trying to sort out if i want to get an add on for the lathe, a cheaper option.
Or just go the whole hog and get a stand alone mill.

If you have the money for a mill now, might as well get one. If you have to save up for a while, like many of us do, get a milling attachment to fill the gap until the money comes for a mill. Finances are often an obstacle. A milling attachment for the lathe will get you through quite a few projects.

Dean

 

[Jadecy]

sent you a PM.

 

[websterz]

I wouldn't just give it away on a whim, but if my lathe and mill were just suddenly missing, the first I would replace would be the lathe.

Dean

First things I'd replace would be the locks on my shop door. :big:

 

[Deanofid]

First things I'd replace would be the locks on my shop door. :big:

Shop is in the house. If someone really wants in, locked doors and glass windows are no obstacle.

 

[Ora Banda]

Built entirely on a Myford ML10 (3 1/4" center height) with a vertical slide for milling plus a drilling machine and a bunch of hand tools.

The chassis is approx 2ft long overall.

A milling machine would have made it easier but the result would have still been the same.

 

[Mainer]

If you look through older volumes of Model Engineer magazine (say, pre-1970s) everything was done with a Myford lathe, milling attachment, and drill press, sometimes not even the drill press. It's certainly possible. You will, however, find it a lot easier with a milling machine. Unless you get particular enjoyment from doing things in a minimalist way, I'd try to find the money to buy a mill.

 

[jimmyocharlie]

like most tools in the shop, once you've got one you'll wonder how you managed without one.

as has been said, most, if not all jobs can be done with very basic tools.

 

[Lakc]

As people have pointed out, with the proper accessories, your lathe can do almost any milling. The Myford is quite a lot more capable in that regard then a Sherline.
What it effectively boils down to, is how much your time is worth. Some people like make every nut and bolt on their engines, I am quite happy with store bought hardware. Where you take it, and how far you take it, is entirely a matter of personal preference, there is no right or wrong way. Any mill will undoubtedly increase your productivity. You have to size your projects to the tools you have at hand.

 

[lazylathe]

A big thank you to everyone that replied!
It was a great help and lead me in the right direction.

Like i said before, i am very new to this amazing hobby and am trying to make things easier for myself.
What i do know is that everytime i remove the headstock or use it to turn angles i end up rechecking everything to ensure it is as aligned as i can get it with my limited knowledge.
What i am trying to avoid is having to do this everytime i need to mill something, if i was to get an attachment i would have to reset and check evrything evrytime i changed.
Once i get the hang of everything it might no be too bad, but i would prefer one less headache!

As i said earlier, i am a Dental Technician, a manager at a large lab. I work in the very small scale and everything has to be perfect or it does not leave the lab.
I am like this with all my work, i will redo it over and over until it is exactly as i want it to be.
So with learning something new like machining, i am hard on myself until i get it right. And not knowing how to adapt and modify tool to get them to do what i want can be troublesome!

But i am going to stick it through and make something that i will be proud of!
So far it is a nice shiny centre punch that i gave to a friend at work who is a woodworking enthusiast!
Money deos not grow on trees in my yard either, so it has to be a careful decision.

Once again thanks for all the help!!!
And for a wonderful forum full of helpful people!