Garage Door

[JohnS]

Now then, I am hoping that the subject title attracts the attention of our garage door expert (you know who you are Ralph !) I imagine I am not the only guy on here who has his workshop located in the domestic garage and dreads the onset of winter. I know its a way off at the moment but I am hoping to reduce the icy blast that finds its way thro and around the up and over ali door.

As a secondary consideration the aluminium door provides virtually no sound insulation and it would ease my social conscience no end if I could reduce the sound of metal being torn apart, not to mention my own expletives of both joy and anguish. I suppose some measures are fairly obvious, like filling all the cracks with mastic and perhaps lining the door interior with some form of insulation board but before making a start I would appreciate any help or advice on the subject.

John S

 

[CrewCab]

Do you need the door, if not remove it and build a stud wall, keep it simple, Match board externally, insulation between the studs and board it internally, ply, mdf etc ...... don't forget some dpm at the bottom etc,

Just a thought










If you need to keep the door ......... that's a whole different ball game.


CC

 

[HS93]

A few Ideas for you , kingspan will prob give you both , but its bulky so you may find the other better for you. don't forget you need to think about the side's where it opens and to and bottom , heavy duty draft excluders made of rubber belting will help .

peter


http://www.insulation.kingspan.com/uk/tp10.htm

http://www.ybsinsulation.com/PDFs/Superquilt.pdf

http://www.sheffins.co.uk/show_subcat.asp?CatID=40

 

[Divided He ad]

I'll not go so far as to say expert John, but I sure know how to fit 'em ;D

I wish it was a simple option.... but most up and over doors must by design have a gap all around them to work correctly.... sorry!

You could opt for a new door which is insulated and sealed around the edges, They are quite frankly awesome!! But as you will be aware cost a bit!
I suppose it all depends on your budget, If you are about to spend £80 -£100 on insulation and mastic etc, then that would be far better put toward a better door!

If you have a nice house and have had double glazing fitted but are one of those people who will keep a battered old painted garage door till the month you put the house on the market You might as well waste some cash on trying to stop the wind etc... if you value your house looks as well as your comfort then a better door is the best way!

It is only my opinion.... But I sure know what I would do!

I might even be able to find an 'ok... slightly shop soiled' single insulated door in the store.... not many there though... Size dependant obviously.... and then there would be figuring out the logistics of the supply/fit. Still nothing is impossible!

I suppose you could seal it up as CC suggested, but check planning etc first.... sometimes they just won't let you do that?



Ralph.

PM me if you want to know more about the door options John ;D

 

[DickDastardly40]

I invested in a roller shutter door made of insulated plastic about 2 years ago.

It has draft excluders on the edge track and a flexible rubber seal at the bottom, it is remote control, not that was importsant to me per se but how it came.

As it is white it brightens the garage considerably, because it is not the up and over type I can have lights closer to the end and also store stuff in the rafters where I couldn't previously. I haven't noticed it flexing and slamming in the wind like before either. You don't bang your head on it and anybody can open it

Budget is everything usually, but as the previous door was shot, I thought it was the way to go.

 

[JohnS]

Thanks guys for your input. I do have to retain use of the door (its the only outdoor access to the back garden) else I would happily have bricked it up and maybe even put a window in. Still you have given me some interesting ideas for which I thank you all.

JohnS

 

[Divided He ad]

Sorry my brain wasn't up to full pressure at 2am so here is what I should have also said.............


IMPORTANT BIT THIS CAN BE DANGEROUS IF YOU PUT ANY EXTRA WEIGHT ONTO THE PANNEL YOU COULD CAUSE THE CABLES/SPRINGS TO SNAP, ALSO THE EXTRA WEIGHT COULD CAUSE THE DOOR TO DROP UNEXPECTIDLY AS YOU WALK THROUGH IT.

Sorry if you know all that but it is important, the springs have enough energy stored to lift the door... usually 50-70 kilos (8-10 stone, 112-140 pounds ish) on a single size(double for a double!) they are to be respected at all times! You could loose fingers, get bashed in the head or worse in a split second.


No joke gents, you respect the power of your machinery, you should also respect the power in a huge spring.


Ralph.

 

[chuck foster]

i just got back form my dads place and i wound the spring a little tighter on his single garage door.
holy crap Ralph you are not kidding about the energy stored in that spring

i never thought about the spring before but it now makes perfect sense. we had no mishap's but i can see where you could get in trouble.
the reason for winding it tighter is that years ago when the door was installed my dad was years younger. he had no trouble lifting the door to open it, but now (years older) it was getting too heavy for him. so with the added tension on the spring he can open the door much easier. he should have done this years ago!

i have great respect for springs, seen a the results of a very large spring getting away on a guy.......he is missing an ear!

chuck

 

[Divided He ad]

Just a thought Chuck... Did you lubricate the spring? The spring should be well oiled (engine oil is good) NOT greased (grease has little/no capillary action).
the oil should also be on the bushes that the bar runs in at either end and on the point where the shaft goes into the little rollers only.... NEVER on the roller or in the channels/tracks!!
Grease/oil in the tracks makes the wheels slide and eventually wears a flat into them making it hard to open the door! the wheels/rollers need to well... Roll! the channels should be clean and dry.

Most people grease the hell out of the channels and leave the spring to go rusty! So very wrong!

Just thought I'd share the maintenance ritual ;D





Ralph.

 

[Julian]

John

I have had up and over doors in past houses. Most builders merchants sell Jablite or similar. It is inch thick polystyrene for house insulation. Cut it to a tight fit in the spars on the back of the door and hold in with mastic or gaffer tape. I used the plastic brush-type door insulation strips around the edges. Not perfect but 90% better and very light. Didn't need to adjust the spring.

Do you need six or eight foot wide access to the back garden? Panel or brick incorporating a door and window combination. My latest is panelled with white upvc hollowboard and a upvc doubleglazed door. Ordinary loft insulation in the wall panels.

Julian

 

[Mcgyver]

I stuck 2" blue styrofoam to the back of a wood door. The door roles in sections, where the sections are hinged i cut the styrofoam on an angle so it wouldn't bind as it goes up and around the curve. There is caulking you can buy that is clear and will seal doors & windows but is easily peeled off - this goes around the edge to stop drafts. Both make a huge difference

 

[JohnS]

Thanks Julian and Mcgyver

What I think I have picked up on is that whatever I insulate the door with it should not add significantly to the weight of the door. Sheets of polystyrene seems to be the way to go but where can you find brush strip _ I know what you mean, but i cant seem to find a supply. I've also got these gaps running along the top and bottom of the door which are letting light in, and presumably chilly draughts in the winter. Maybe one of those expanding foam aerosols or maybe a tub of mastic - any ideas guys ?

John S

 

[Divided He ad]

There is not a waving smiley so .... Cooo eeee! Over here John! ;D

I know a man who knows a man who owns a firm of which I work at that could tell me so I can tell you where to find such a strip!

Also, if the gap you are referring to is the one above the door (between the frame and the door) not the one above the frame (between the frame and lintel) then DON'T use foam or even silicone on it... It will glue the door shut and make it very, very difficult to open it again without damage.

Been looking at the sealing ideas.... pity your 2 odd hours away or we'd have sorted this already

If your door has the steel frame, the top can be sealed using stick on foam draught excluder (the type you use on old draughty house doors) stick it to the inside face of the lip that hangs down.

If it has a wooden frame, then the fitters should have fitted a steel angled strip to do the same job as the lip above (some just throw it away... especially the unaware dozy builders!!!) so it should be similar...Unless it is fitted badly and too far away! If there is no strip there... P.M. me and we will figure it out. ;D

Everything is do-able to an extent! ;D



Ralph.

 

[CrewCab]

Everything is do-able to an extent! ;D

Quite right and ........... Anything is do-able if you throw enough money at it ........ but in the real world (not being an MP : ) ....... we all have to do the best we can

John, I could sum this up with a drawing much easier ....... but here goes :

Visualise the pivot point of the door, above it the seal needs to be on the door, below it it needs to be on the frame, usually the doors come with crappy plastic seals that don't do much. If you replace these with strips of 3mm thick hardwood faced plywood (try Travis Perkins) and then add some draught excluder tape (B&Q) it should help greatly, treat the plywood and screw or rivet it to the door would be my approach ........... anything thicker than 3mm would be too inflexible imho
As for insulation for the door, don't use polystyrene, a high performance polyurethane board such as Kingspan it's far far better ............ and easier to work with, Wickes do a similar product I believe.

As Ralph rightly said don't seal the gaps with anything or you won't be able to open your door ???

CC

 

[HS93]

This is very light weight so will not cause problems of weight. and is very good and easy to fit a couple of batterns and self tappers, use rubber belting for draft excluders.

Peter


http://www.screwfix.com/prods/21112...ulation/Airtec-Double-Insulation-1-05m-x-25m#

 

[Mcgyver]

I've also got these gaps running along the top and bottom of the door which are letting light in, and presumably chilly draughts in the winter

As i mentioned, there's a product for this. Comes in a caulking tube, is clear and handles like silicon. It seals, but it is intended for seasonal use around windows and easily peels off (when dry) by hand should you need to remove it (at the end of the season). I just went to the shop and looked for a tube to quote a brand but no luck, probably the wrong time of year to find it on the shelf, that is for us northern hemisphere types...hopefully it turns up in the fall in a store near you....but it is definitely the product you need for this application

 

[Bogstandard]

I know it sounds a bit silly, up against all these technical bits, but have you thought of the universal problem solver.
Duct tape.

Wack it on for the winter, door sealed, peel it off in the spring, door opens.

John

 

[Julian]

John,

The brush sealers are available at Wilkinsons. Go to the one in syston when you visit Ketan.
They also do rolls of the narrow foam type but it adds to the thickness and can stop the door latching.


Julian.

 

[JohnS]

I would like to thank everyone who has offered me advice and information on keeping icy cold winds at bay in my garage workshop next winter. I do need to maintain access thro the door which ruled out semi permanent sealing. Brush or blade seals seem to be the way to go. I have now come across http://www.awstrading.co.uk/List.aspx?CatID=27 and they have a range of products that could well provide the answer.

Once again many thanks to you all

John S