The story of a Kansas boys shop/toolroom/house.

Discussion in 'The Shop' started by WSMkid, Feb 11, 2018.

Help Support HMEM by donating using the link above.
  1. Feb 11, 2018 #1

    WSMkid

    WSMkid

    WSMkid

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2012
    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    14
    As mentioned in my post about my machines I'm building a shop.

    I've been renting a two bed room apartment since I started my job in June. It is pretty nice and the garage has enough room for my (3) motor cycles, side by side and small tool cabinet but to me renting is just throwing away money. My spare bedroom has been taken over by my reloading bench, various gun stuff and my 3D printer.

    I knew after about two months working here that I would be sticking around for awhile. Productive work environment yet relaxed and the pay is good. I found three lots in a small town south of work for sale and after 6months messing with the city gov. to get undeveloped roads closed I now own it and am waiting for the grown to thaw to start doing the dirt work.

    The building:
    I decided on post frame construction. The main building with be 35'x60' with 14' walls. The south end will have one 12' and one 10' over head door. The north end of this building will be closed off and climate controlled. It will be used at my tool room / gun room.

    The "house":
    My living space will be built into a 16' lean-to that will run the entire 60' of the west side of the building. It will have one bedroom with a bathroom between the bedroom and open kitchen. I will have a sliding class door to go from the living to the shop and a proper front door on the south of the house.

    All floors with be slab with floor heat to three different zones. Cooling and some heating will be provided by a "mini split" system with three zones (living room, bedroom, tool room).

    At first I was looking at building a house with an over sized garage planing for if I ever find a girl that I get along with well enough to get married. I decided on this because I'm sure if I built something she would not like it and would want something different anyway.

    I'm having a local company build the building and I intend to finish the inside to my liking. My goal is to be done enough in June I can move into it when my lease is up. I'm planning on total cost being around $70k.

    I hope to update the along the way. If you have built any thing like this I would like feedback on what you would do different.

    Thank you for thanking the time to stop by.

    GJ
     
    rlukens likes this.
  2. Feb 12, 2018 #2

    stevehuckss396

    stevehuckss396

    stevehuckss396

    Senior Member

    Joined:
    Nov 19, 2008
    Messages:
    3,788
    Likes Received:
    885
    Sounds like the perfect setup. Good luck on the build. Hope it goes smooth.
     
    rad45 likes this.
  3. Feb 12, 2018 #3

    DJP

    DJP

    DJP

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2012
    Messages:
    288
    Likes Received:
    87
    Consider lining the interior of your shop with barn tin. It's effective in keeping the shop cool in summer and warm in winter. It's also easy to clean and rugged. Used tin sheets mounted backwards work well as there is no need for the interior sheets to be fastened with rain proof screws along the ridges.

    A thought for your consideration.
     
  4. Feb 13, 2018 #4

    WSMkid

    WSMkid

    WSMkid

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2012
    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    14
    DJP,
    Thank you for the comment. I had not thought of using used tin. My father tined over the insulation of his 40x60 he built in 05. It is very nice to clean and he used white, combined with the white epoxy floor and white ceiling insulation it is very bright (even with %60 of the fluorescent bulbs not working).
    I will likely sheet rock the "toolroom" and leave the main shop studs until I get to the point I can insulate it, then tin over it.

    What is everyone using for wall coverings in their shop? Sheetrock? OSB?

    GJ
     
  5. Feb 13, 2018 #5

    ShopShoe

    ShopShoe

    ShopShoe

    Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2010
    Messages:
    797
    Likes Received:
    125
    A point in favor of sheetrock is that it will help stop the spread of fire, if you are so unlucky.

    That said, plywood of some type gives you plenty of surface to mount things to, wherever you want.

    Kieth Rucker on YouTube has been building a 40 x 80 foot shop over many months and has covered his walls with a plywood he calls "beadboard", to make the shop seem old-timey. He has added the tin sheeting (usually used for walls) horizontally to cover the plywood from the floor up to about four feet, to stop sparks and make things easier to clean. I'm sorry I don't have a link to a specific video which covers all this as the shop build has been ongoing for quite some time. Find him on YouTube by searching "Kieth Rucker" or "VintageMachinery.org"

    I have a mixture of sheetrock and plywood, with special attention paid to plywood behind my benches.

    I have also used a material which is basically tempered hardboard (like masonite) with a polished and hardened white coating applied. It is very easy to wipe clean of splashed lathe oil, dust, etc. I found it with the paneling at both Menard's and Lowe's home centers in my area. It works very well stapled over cheap plywood.

    Tell us what you do. We like pictures.

    --ShopShoe
     
  6. Feb 17, 2018 #6

    WSMkid

    WSMkid

    WSMkid

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2012
    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    14
    ShopShoe thank you for stopping by, I agree with OSB/chipboard/plywood allows a person to expand there work space.

    Wednesday night my mother and father showed up about 6pm with there skid steer.

    Official start date of Feb. 14!

    Yesterday I went to work at 5 and was able to sneak out a noon to go help. We met for lunch then headed to the site. While I was at work dad had the pad %90 to grade and mom had made enemy's with the laser transit.
    After another two hours we had the 60x70ish pad to within +-1/2". Dad is the Charlie Daniels of the skid steer.
    With things leveled out he set to a final pack and cleaning up dirt while I cut brush.
    Just before dark we spread out a little gravel for the drive way.

    Below (hopefully) is the result. Building guy is to set posts 3/1 so not much to do till then but cut brush and watch it burn, under supervision of a cooler and buddies of course.

    View attachment IMG_1756.jpg
     
    bazmak likes this.
  7. Feb 17, 2018 #7

    rlukens

    rlukens

    rlukens

    Well-Known Member Project of the Month Winner

    Joined:
    Feb 23, 2010
    Messages:
    99
    Likes Received:
    47
    Sounds like a hell of an adventure. I've been happily married forever, but I like you style.
     
  8. Feb 18, 2018 #8

    DJP

    DJP

    DJP

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2012
    Messages:
    288
    Likes Received:
    87
    If you are planning to heat the concrete floors with either electric wire or hot water tubing, be sure to set anchors in the cement during the pour even if you are not sure of the exact machine locations. Drilling later is high risk of ruining your heated floor. The anchors will give you location info even if they don't line up with the machines or with a future interior wall.

    You didn't mention any plans for your shop to support auto repair. An above ground hoist would be a good addition but that too will need anchors in the concrete. I have a 12 foot ceiling in my shop so the hoist works well.

    Be sure to have enough 240VAC capacity in your shop. It's not a big deal if only one person is working at a time but if a crew comes to work you need to support all of the machines running at the same time.

    Finally lighting is best if you can run a continuous line of tubes. The loss with a high ceiling is less from a line source. A couple of strings to reduce shadows is also a benefit if you ever spray paint in the shop. I also prefer task lighting so that each machine or workstation has a lamp. This may be an age related requirement that you can add later.

    Building storage above the ceiling is easier during initial construction and you may want to add a steel beam for a future lift point. Adding these things later is a nuisance so plan them now if you can.

    Just some thoughts for your consideration at this stage of your planning.
     
  9. Feb 18, 2018 #9

    WSMkid

    WSMkid

    WSMkid

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2012
    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    14
    DJP thank you for stopping by.

    I have kept a two post lift in mind throughout the designing, it's the main reason for the second over head door. I've decided to not include floor heat in the main shop area. The price to install can be used for conventional heat and better insolation down the road. With that being said I have intentions to end up with a thicker pad in the rough areas where the posts will stand.

    I've no intentions to anchor any other equipment to the slab.

    GJ

    Edit: Also thank you for the recommendations on lighting, I will keep the strip theory in mind.
     
  10. Feb 19, 2018 #10

    ShopShoe

    ShopShoe

    ShopShoe

    Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2010
    Messages:
    797
    Likes Received:
    125
    Floor Heat.

    Even if you don't use it now, it might be a good idea if you put the tubes in while pouring. I wish I had pushed the contractor who built my garage to do that as I would only be a boiler away from a nicely-heated garage/shop.

    Just the voice of experience,

    --ShopShoe
     
    bazmak likes this.
  11. Feb 20, 2018 #11

    WSMkid

    WSMkid

    WSMkid

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2012
    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    14


    This is one of those things I know I am going to kick my self for not doing but at ~$2ft^ my budget/tightness is refraining me.

    Thank you for stopping by.


    If all goes according to plan we should be working on the pluming in the slab weekend after next.

    GJ
     
  12. Feb 27, 2018 #12

    Wizard69

    Wizard69

    Wizard69

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2013
    Messages:
    1,104
    Likes Received:
    217

    I simply don't see in floor radiant heating being a good idea in a work shop supporting heavy machinery.

    First off there will be things you will eventually want bolted to the floor. Drill presses are one example, any work bench supporting a large vise also should be bolted down.

    Second you don't know what the future holds as far as machine installations go. You might need to install a thicker pad for a larger mill or cut a channel for air, water or electrical.

    Speaking of thickness you likely would be better off installing a thicker pad with the money saved. Further use the saved money to put rebar in the floor. Id even look into electrical grounding methods that use the floor.
     
  13. Feb 27, 2018 #13

    WSMkid

    WSMkid

    WSMkid

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2012
    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    14
    Wizard,

    I have grown up in a shop with nothing bolted down. our vice was on an old truck rim so i could be easily moved. Our welding table is 4x6 3/8" plate with 5 1/2" casing for legs and a tray under it for storing grinders, pipe wrenches and other tools, i would guess it weighs over 500 lbs. I don't know what kind of work you do but that bench is heavy enough to stay put.

    Your correct, i dont know what the future holds but if i get to the point that this is more than a hobby shop, i will want to build a different building to keep my work away from my play.

    The slab will be the standard 4.5" with rebar in it.

    GJ
     
  14. Feb 27, 2018 #14

    Wizard69

    Wizard69

    Wizard69

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Mar 9, 2013
    Messages:
    1,104
    Likes Received:
    217
    Deleted double post. Sorry!

    In any event to respond to comments about bolting stuff diwn, the comment is the result of a couple of things. One is that drill presses are often top heavy and easy to roll over. Another is the issue i have had with bench mounted vises and said benches walking or rolling when you get aggressive with something.

    The other issue i have had is machines moving while in use. This is a problem ive had with smaller wood working tools that personally bothers me. In some cases ive gone to making the machines bench very heavy such as my router table. Mass does help to anchor things but that isn't always a solution. Another potentially unstable machine happens to be my bandsaw but that can be addressed with infeed and outfeed supports.

    In any event i mentioned bolting down machines and benches not because you will do it in any case but because it might be an option that makes a lot of sense after understanding what you are doing. Also after building a shop srea, in my case currently that is the cellar, i often find myself building things i didn't even imagine before. I know some guys are very focused with respect to what they do in their shops, that isn't me!!!
     
  15. Feb 28, 2018 #15

    ShopShoe

    ShopShoe

    ShopShoe

    Senior Member

    Joined:
    Oct 2, 2010
    Messages:
    797
    Likes Received:
    125
    I agree that you might want to bolt things down at some point. I also think stronger, thicker concrete is a better idea (another voice of experience thing.)

    The best advice I read (on this forum, I think) was when putting in anchors, drill all the way through the slab, so that when you no longer need the anchor, you can punch it down and fill the hole. I already have a set of anchor bolts left in my slab from a previous machine that I have to leave just ground flush with the floor.

    Another thing I have done is drill some holes at an angle so I could have an attachment point for using a come-along ("cable winch puller") to move heavy loads.

    Another suggestion I have heard (for thicker concrete) is to form in a "tunnel" underneath before pouring to facilitate getting power or ??? to a future in-floor location. I was told that "...you just drill down with a core drill and hit the tunnel." Interesting, but you'd have to make a good guess as to where you might want to locate something like that. (And I would guess make appropriate reinforcement as well.)

    All of this, like the in-floor heating, requires some detailed record-keeping, but it might be worthwhile.

    --ShopShoe
     
  16. Mar 16, 2018 #16

    WSMkid

    WSMkid

    WSMkid

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2012
    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    14
    In one week I went from having a bunch of random looking posts in the ground to having a building.

    Friday Saturday Sunday and Monday were spent lay foam and the pex for the slab to be pored. (My self)

    Monday the crew worked on grading the main shop area, and getting headers and stringers put up.

    Tuesday they tied rebar and had all the trusses up.

    View attachment IMG_1787.jpg

    Wednesday they pored the floor at 8am. At noon when I stoped by they were getting ready to hang tin. By 5 when I stopped by they had all the tin on the north wall and were about to finish the west part of the roof and west wall

    View attachment IMG_1788.jpg

    View attachment IMG_1789.jpg

    Today when I stoped my at 5 they had all the windows hung, both walk in doors and both over head doors up, all the tin on the east side of the roof and all the east wall. When I left they had about 10' of tin to put up on the south wall and both door handles.
    I felt kinda bad buggin these guys with pics so I old took one out of there way. It just shows the tin and trim color.

    View attachment IMG_1791.jpg

    This weekend is my nieces birthday (1year old, I'm sure she will remember it) next weekend my dad has a fishing trip (part time catfish guide in northern Oklahoma) so we are planing to get all the stud walls up weekend after next.

    It feels good to have something standing.

    Thanks for stopping by.

    GJ
     
    bazmak likes this.
  17. Mar 17, 2018 #17

    slaurenson

    slaurenson

    slaurenson

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Nov 4, 2012
    Messages:
    59
    Likes Received:
    40
    ohhh look at the size of that! I have a 12meter by 12 meter but that looks so clean and ready for building benches in! very jealous!!
     
  18. Mar 17, 2018 #18

    bazmak

    bazmak

    bazmak

    BAZMAK

    Joined:
    Dec 12, 2012
    Messages:
    1,995
    Likes Received:
    1,112
    From the photos i see horiz and vert rails for the walls but no diagonal bracing
    I know the the tin will give a diaphram action for stiffening but i have never seen walls in timber or steel without diagonal cross bracing.Are you in the land of tornados etc. My tuppence only but i keep viewing your interesting posts
    with admiration for your speed of build and the unique way you are building
    both a residence and a workshop for your self.Keep the photos and input coming
     
  19. May 2, 2018 #19

    WSMkid

    WSMkid

    WSMkid

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Sep 26, 2012
    Messages:
    79
    Likes Received:
    14
    Wow.. what a crazy month and a half it has been. So very unexpected twists have come up on this road I've been taking.

    So! As an update on the building.... it's basically done. Sheetrock should be mudded and finish s handed Friday. I am taking Monday and Tuesday off to make sure painting gets done. We also plan to hand the interior doors and trim them. Possibly install switches and outlets.

    The sad thing is that I will not get to live in it.

    Two weeks ago I received a call from a company "back home" that I had interviewed with two years ago. They asked for an interview and afterwords they made me an offer. We agreed upon a price and I start June 4th.

    Now I no longer just have the stress of building a house and being moved out of my appartment before may 24th when I leave for an Canadian fishing trip. I also have the stress of moving my stuff 200 miles (I have a LOT of "stuff") and selling this thing we have been working on about every weekend for the last couple months and have a fair amount of money tied up in.
    Do I think it will sell? Yes. If I didn't think it had resale I would have build something that did. Do I expect it to take a while to find the right person? Yes.

    So, it's pretty sad to leave all this work up here but hopefully I can make a little money on it.

    For the time being I will be moving back in with my parents ("ya this guy is a winner") and driving the ~30 miles to the plant.

    Thank you for stopping by.

    GJ
     
  20. May 3, 2018 #20

    DJP

    DJP

    DJP

    Well-Known Member

    Joined:
    Dec 7, 2012
    Messages:
    288
    Likes Received:
    87
    Tornados over the next few days could relocate your new work shop 200 miles for you. Hopefully that's not a viable plan.

    Thanks for the update. I was once told that a working person's 30 year career can be divided into three 10 year sections. During the first 10 years you should try as many jobs/careers as you like. Doing the second 10 years become renown in one of those careers and during the last 10 years just enjoy being renown.

    My children tell me that in the Internet world these time periods are much shorted but you get the idea.

    Take care.
     

Share This Page