Rust vs tea, Round 1

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steamboatmodel

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Andrewinpopayan said:
I believe the tannin used for tanning is extracted from the english oak tree, possibly from the acorns.
Wikipedia under Tanning has "Vegetable tanning uses tannin (this is where the name tanning comes from). Tannin occurs naturally in bark. The primary barks used in modern times are chestnut, oak, tanoak, hemlock, quebracho, mangrove, wattle and myrobalan."
Regards,
Gerald
 

Cedge

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Kludge
I can personally vouch for the effectiveness of Coca Cola, at least as used as a penetrating solution. We used it from time to time when I had my company running.

Recently, I had a young fellow in to do some work around the house. Like many of us at his age, we didn't have what one would call dependable transportation and his proved to be less than dependable, out on the street, right in front of the house. The kid had carpentry tools, but not so much as a Crescent wrench with him.

I loaned the kid some tools and tried to stay out of his way until I began hearing some blue sneaking into his escalating mumbles, from the garage. I wandered up to see what the major malfunction was and there he was about to bust a testicle over a seized bolt.

I stopped him and told him to take a break while I got him a solution to his conundrum. He looked at me like I had 3 eyes as I returned and poured a can of Coca Cola all over the bolts that he had left to remove. I told him to take it easy and finish his smoke, as he began to laugh and make somewhat deriding comments about old men and lost marbles.

This old man then took the wrench from the kids hand and gently broke the offending bolt loose with minimal effort. The look on his face was totally worth having taken his previous comments in stride....(evil grin).

Having done a few jobs around Coca Cola bottling plants, I was well aware that their mechanics have used the stuff for parts degreasing, engine washing, rust removing and nut busting..... for many many years.

Steve
 
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Kludge

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Cedge said:
This old man then took the wrench from the kids hand and gently broke the offending bolt loose with minimal effort. The look on his face was totally worth having taken his previous comments in stride....(evil grin).
I love it! That particular story belongs in the humor thread!

Having done a few jobs around Coca Cola bottling plants, I was well aware that their mechanics have used the stuff for parts degreasing, engine washing, rust removing and nut busting..... for many many years.
Okay, that takes Coke out of the "maybe" stack and into the "real" stack. It also means a cross slide I have gets the Coke treatment since it suffers grease, mild rust and stuck screws. This will confuse a few people at Tamura's since they know I'm a Pepsi-person. ;D

Actually, that raises a question as to which soft drink contains the highest concentration of phosphoric acid. They're probably really close but it's not the sort of statistic one would consider as being all that important. Maybe the FDA has something on it.

Brian ... the Brer Rabbit molasses I bought says it's been "unsulphured", whatever that means. I wonder if that's going to have an effect on the results.

BEst regards,

Kludge
 
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Kludge

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baldrocker said:
If its really light rust do you use Diet Coke?
Hmmm ... good question. It goes with another which asks if I need to use Lime Coke if it's British steel.

Best regards,

Kludge
 
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Kludge

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ksouers said:
Or Sprite if it's aluminum? ;D
And 7-Up if it's a copper alloy?

We all know there are various grades of steel based on carbon content so do we use Coke that's lost its fizz on low carbon steel and fresh new Coke on high carbon grades?

And what about zinc, tin and lead? Titanium can take care of itself since I can't afford any anyway. I suspect mercury could be a volatile subject so maybe it's best left alone.

So many metals, so few soft drinks!

Best regards,

Kludge

 

macona

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As a vet friend has said every animal has enough brains to tan its own hide.
So saying to someone "I am going to beat your brains out and tan your hide" is theoretically possible?
 

jack404

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If i may add to this

i have a big interest in ancient technologies

there is a iron pole in europe (switzerland? germany? belgium? somewhere there its 1 am here sorry) over 600 years old

it does not rust .. why??

different theories abound from ludwig ( a ancient preist/chemist) to aliens.. but the main thought is this

when it was made it was too big to be tossed in the trough or water barrels they had so they threw it in the local bog to temper it. Bogs are great for concentrated tannins in a natural form.

the area has a lot of peat ( rotted vegetable matter) and digging a hole in the ground will get ground water this water is chock full of these tannins so they cast this thing dug a hole big enough to accept it and it lay in the hole full of tannins and the heat and tannins got to work and made the outside tannerific ( if thats correct term )

as for tea i think its a bit weak but i have experimented with the native willow here cut it up put it in water and let it rot for 8 months over winter remove the pulp every few months and add more.

i'll take some pics of the results in the morning for you all, it worked ok better if the iron or steel is heated before dousing in the mix and better if left for a day and cleaned and oiled after to stop the water starting the oxidization process again. It worked better on iron than steel but 1040 was still ok and could be used at a pinch but the colour is not great.. i prefer a nice rust blue with a touch of cobalt added to the mix

cheers and goodnight

jack



 
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Kludge

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jack404 said:
i have a big interest in ancient technologies
That's an exceptionally interesting speciality in archeology. I tend to like things like the Baghdad Battery, possible lost technologies that could have had a profound effect had they been developed. (I tend to go with the idea that it was an early attempt at electroplating which is only one of several ideas advanced for it.)

it does not rust .. why??
Black Forest Gnomes. I thought everyone knew that! :D

Bogs are great for concentrated tannins in a natural form.
We're a bit light in bogs here but there is some freshwater swampland that has been swampland for hundreds (if not thousands) of years. The primary water source is rainwater and there's plenty of dead vegetation at the bottom - enough to cause the occasional wiff of methane to seep to the surface. I wonder if these would also be sufficiently rich in tannins to work.

as for tea i think its a bit weak but i have experimented with the native willow here cut it up put it in water and let it rot for 8 months over winter remove the pulp every few months and add more.
You've obviously not had my tea. ;D

I'll have to see what would work here. I think I remember seeing some willow somewhere - or something very much like it. If not, then I need to dig around to see what matches with the tannin sources mentioned previously.

i'll take some pics of the results in the morning for you all
I'd love to see how you do this bit of majique. :)

it worked ok better if the iron or steel is heated before dousing in the mix and better if left for a day and cleaned and oiled after to stop the water starting the oxidization process again.
Heated how hot?

This is a fascinating bit of history brought to life. Thank you!

Best regards,

Kludge ... who enjoys history
 
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Kermit

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The piece of "stuff" that separates the two halves of a pecan is pretty much pure tannin.

A few of those boiled in water would give you loads of tannic acid.


Perfect time of year to find plenty of pecans around,
Kermit
 
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Kludge

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Kermit said:
The piece of "stuff" that separates the two halves of a pecan is pretty much pure tannin.
Cool. I never knew that before.

Perfect time of year to find plenty of pecans around,
Not in Hawaii. We have Koa, Monkeypod, Banyan, Keawe, Ironwood, Bamboo, Plumeria, several flavors of Palm and a few others but no Pecan or much of anything else common to the mainland. Its actually pretty cool being surrounded by what some consider exotic wood. :D

BEst regards,

Kludge
 

rleete

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Kludge said:
Its actually pretty cool being surrounded by what some consider exotic wood.
You might have seen it before, but I found it interesting that the shell of a coconut is pretty nice wood. Difficult to get more than a small piece of it, but it polishes up quite nicely. I once made a nice nut bowl out of a whole nut, by carefully sawing off the top. Sand and polish to suit.
 
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Kludge

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Yep, yep, coconut shell is lovely. It, palm leaf and bamboo are among the popular materials used here for craft work. (I really should get back to Waikiki someday to see if the couple making woven palm leaf hats are still there. Mine kind of wore out. :))

I spent five month homeless here (or, as I preferred to call it, "temporarily displaced") during which time I was able to scrounge some discarded coconuts (Supermarkets won't keep them past a certain time.) which I husked, cleaned out and polished to make into pieces one of the vendors at the craft fairs sold for me.

Someday I guess I should tell more about that time but suffice it to say it was one of the more creative times in my life - out of pure necessity. It was also very instructive.

BEst regards,

Kludge
 

raym 11

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Sometime during one of my other lives I remember a woman rubbing a cut in half coconut on the Phillippine Mahogany floor with her foot while doing her other housework or carrying on a conversation.
Beautifull polished floors.

Ray M
 
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Kludge

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ElGringo said:
Sometime during one of my other lives I remember a woman rubbing a cut in half coconut on the Phillippine Mahogany floor with her foot while doing her other housework or carrying on a conversation. Beautifull polished floors.
Hmmm ... I still have some coconut shell pieces in storage. I wonder how they'd be on both wood and metal turnings as burnishers. It might even start a trend. :D

BTW: part of my family tree wound up in the Philippines by means unknown and I've been considering going there to find out what I can.

BEst regards,

Kludge
 

raym 11

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KLUDGE:

I'm sure the cocunuts I speak of were muuch fresher.

If it wren't such a pain to post pic's here I would send some of the Phillippines, although probably not related to your relatives.

Luzon is a good island to start on for searching archives I think. Bless the Pacific Islands and the folks whom kept them whole.
Ray M
 
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Kludge

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ElGringo said:
I'm sure the cocunuts I speak of were muuch fresher.
The ones I got were still quite good (You don't think I let the innards go to waste, do you? :D) but all had a "freshness" date which was conservative at best. It's like pineapples. Properly, they should be eaten when a beautiful golden brown which they hold for a while but I recovered them in still fresh condition due to conservative dating. (And now I've had quite enough coconut & pineapple to last me the rest of my life.)

On the other hand, they weren't right off the tree - maybe a couple weeks older.

Luzon is a good island to start on for searching archives I think. Bless the Pacific Islands and the folks whom kept them whole.
From the information I have at present, my best bet is to base out of Baguio City rather than Manila or Quezon City since everything suggests Ilocano rather than Tagalog or Visayan. The Mormon records have helped some as has some information from people I know in the Philippines but the trail peters out just when it gets interesting. I suspect my great grandfather, a Swedish ship captain who already had two wives (one each in Sweden and Russia) and could easily have put in somewhere in the Philippines.

So, yes, folks, I come by it honestly. There are quite a few scoundrels (and one bishop who is vastly outnumbered) in my line. Makes life more interesting that way. ;D

Anyway, coconut shell is hard and extremely durable (They can float around in the ocean for months without problems which is one way they propogate.), and takes a very high polish with some greasy elbows. (Curb stones were great for the first cut down. :)) So I suspect that at least one of the pieces I have left will become a burnisher.

Ain't it cool?

BEst regards,

Kludge
 

Epicyclic

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I saw an entry in a horology website about using a strong saturated black tea solution to deoxidize clock and watch parts.

I guess the watchmaking community has used that for quite a number of years.
 

Stan

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Welcome back Kludge. I hope your health has improved to where you can be a contributor again.
 
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