Kit Comparison?

[ACHiPo]

Hi,
I’m contemplating my first model engine build. I’m leaning toward a cast kit. Stuart seems to have a good reputation, and a price to go with it. How does Stuart compare to PM, et al? What’s a good starter kit? Should I build a steam plant (intimidating) or build an engine first and run off compressed air?

I have looked unsuccessfully for comparisons between kits, although the early Stuart’s seem to be prized.

i have a Logan 816 lathe and Enco 8x35 mill, so machining capacity shouldn’t be an issue? Although skill could be! ;-)

 

[coulsea]

start with air, its much more convenient.
I would go with barstock first because if you make a mistake you just start again. castings are difficult because nothing is square, where do you start and how do you hold it.
if you want to go with castings PM are cheaper for a first try, don't worry if its not your ideal engine because you need to build at least 10 before its called a collection.
happy building

 

[deverett]

If/when you decide to try machining a Stuart engine, there are books available to assist you (Stuart Steam list them) but they might be available cheaper elsewhere.
https://www.stuartmodels.com/produc...ccessories/books--catalogues---drawings/booksThere are build articles on the 'net as well. Here's one to start you off:
http://www.homews.co.uk/page42.htmlDave
The Emerald Isle

 

[ACHiPo]

If/when you decide to try machining a Stuart engine, there are books available to assist you (Stuart Steam list them) but they might be available cheaper elsewhere.
https://www.stuartmodels.com/produc...ccessories/books--catalogues---drawings/booksThere are build articles on the 'net as well. Here's one to start you off:
http://www.homews.co.uk/page42.htmlDave
The Emerald Isle

Dave,
Thanks. I saw the books on Stuart's site and definitely planned to add one to the order if I go that route. I emailed Stuart and they recommended the S50, 10V, and 10H as good "starter" models. I like the look of the 10V, although understand the reality of a few mistakes on the first few models.

start with air, its much more convenient.
I would go with barstock first because if you make a mistake you just start again. castings are difficult because nothing is square, where do you start and how do you hold it.
if you want to go with castings PM are cheaper for a first try, don't worry if its not your ideal engine because you need to build at least 10 before its called a collection.
happy building

Coulsea,
I'd thought about barstock a while back, and still could do something out of it as a way to machine and build a mechanism rather than just tools or fixtures, but I'm intrigued with the casting challenges. I do have a few old books from Tubal Caine (the old British character, not Mr. Pete) on building models. Maybe I'll look through them again and find one I fancy.

Evan

 

[Sprocket]

I’d second the bar stock idea. I
Still find castings intimidating.
Doug

 

[rleete]

Castings are MUCH more difficult for new machinists. Work holding, order of operations, and lack of datums all make them more of a challenge. Start with a simple bar stock oscillator or one of Elmer's engines (Elmers Engines Steam Engine Plans) and go from there.

 

[tornitore45]

I like to build engines, when I built my first steamer I felt the compulsion to build the steam plant.
I regretted the decision
1) Is not like building engines, is an entirely different set of skills, tooling, material and techniques.
2) Not much machining but lots of sheet metal and tube bending, plumbing and fitting.
3) Fuel choice, no matter what you pick is a hassle.

My opinion, some folks like it and there is nothing wrong with that.

If you show you engine to friends or at a show you are 99% sure to use compressed air.

 

[ACHiPo]

Ok, y'all have convinced me. An Elmer's wobbler it is. I found his book for free download online (it's evidently out of print and people are asking crazy money for it like $600)

 

[peterl95124]

I'll third the opinion about casting kits, I made several bar stock steam engines all perfectly successful, then tried a Stuart #9 casting kit and screwed it up because I didn't think far enough ahead and the cylinder ended up having to be slightly offset from the center of its mounting in order to align with the crankshaft, argh !!!

Remember the old joke about how to carve an elephant, start with a block of marble and chip away everything that doesn't look like an elephant, well with a casting kit you are starting with those blocks of marble somewhere inside of which are the planes and cylinders of a perfectly machined and aligned steam engine, but finding the precise locations of those planes and cylinders can be difficult !!!

 

[Misterg]

There's a Youtube channel called 'Learning Turning Metal' where a guy called Andrew Whale has documented his builds of a few Stuart Turner engines. He is / was a relative beginner, so makes a few mistakes, but he *tells* you about them (rather than trying to be a pseudo expert). I think it gives an excellent idea of what is involved in machining from castings (and I find it quite watchable).

e.g. the S10V

 

[SmithDoor]

You good point on work holding.
I have been machining so long I forget the part on work holding.
Bar stock is easy for work holding and when you make mistake just buy more bar stock.

Dave

Castings are MUCH more difficult for new machinists. Work holding, order of operations, and lack of datums all make them more of a challenge. Start with a simple bar stock oscillator or one of Elmer's engines (Elmers Engines Steam Engine Plans) and go from there.

 

[ACHiPo]

There's a Youtube channel called 'Learning Turning Metal' where a guy called Andrew Whale has documented his builds of a few Stuart Turner engines. He is / was a relative beginner, so makes a few mistakes, but he *tells* you about them (rather than trying to be a pseudo expert). I think it gives an excellent idea of what is involved in machining from castings (and I find it quite watchable).

e.g. the S10V

This is great!

 

[ACHiPo]

This guy is quite good as well(Keith Appleton). And funny!
https://www.youtube.com/playlist?list=PLDV_TkPc48RFIUtHqzTAYmXhr3mOm-tZ6