Diamond allen wrenches...

[Wagon173]

So this may be a rookie mistake, but maybe I can save another rookie a few bucks in carbide from posting it. I read that in my steam engine you shouldn't use an aluminum piston with an aluminum cylinder. I know that rule in general but figured that it wouldn't matter in such a small engine. Being a brand new model engineer, I took the advice. So I searched and searched my shop for some sort of steel. After about 15 minutes of turning up nothing, my set of allen keys caught my eye. I'd always thought the 10mm key was about an inch and a half too long... I cut through it okay. I just had to go slow and put a decent amount of downward force on it with trusty ole hack saw and a little wd40. When I got it to the lathe, however, I chewed through my HSS bit. Figuring it was hardened, I busted out the carbide. I also chewed through three pieces of carbide before I took a step off my pride and admitted defeat. I had no idea cheap allen keys were made out of pure kryptonite!

 

[stevehuckss396]

I'm sure your not the first to try it.

 

[rklopp]

Allen keys are reasonably machineable with carbide if you have a rigid setup. I've done it several times. Rigidity is the key. As in Cochester Chipmaster or Monarch 10EE rigid.

 

[Wagon173]

Lol unfortunately all I have is a small CM 7x10 lathe. It's not too shabby and I'm able to turn within .001 after some clean up and improving the carriage. The tailstock also needed quite a bit of love. However, I had no idea that allen keys were as hard as they are. With as many as I've stripped out, I never would have thought. I wound up getting some drill rod very cheap from a guy that never picked up his order from metal supermarket. Since it was already the correct diameter I didn't have to turn it. I just had to cut it to length and drill the hole for the crank pin. Allan key: 1 Brandon: 0

 

[MachineTom]

What happened is not what you think. Carbide will eat through allen keys like nothing. Un less it is misapplied, and that is Carbide is very hard, and like many hard items it is also brittle, so it does not do well in interrupted cuts. So those six points of the hex came around each rev and knocked a piece of carbide off, result junk cutter.

If you took a carbide cutter, and feed enough tool that the point was at the base diameter of the work, ( .300 base circle on a 5/16 wrench) and then moved the carriage it will turn off those hex points with a slight buzzing sound, not a knocking jumping as I guess it was when you tried last.,

 

[Wizard69]

Lol unfortunately all I have is a small CM 7x10 lathe. It's not too shabby and I'm able to turn within .001 after some clean up and improving the carriage. The tailstock also needed quite a bit of love. However, I had no idea that allen keys were as hard as they are. With as many as I've stripped out, I never would have thought. I wound up getting some drill rod very cheap from a guy that never picked up his order from metal supermarket. Since it was already the correct diameter I didn't have to turn it. I just had to cut it to length and drill the hole for the crank pin. Allan key: 1 Brandon: 0

It is my understanding that most Allen wrenches are made from S7 or vary similar steel, heat treated to be highly resistant to breakage. They aren't extremely hard relative to what is possible.

So not knowing more about what you set up was like I can't say what went wrong. Allen wrenches are generally machineable with carbide so I'd look closely at feed rates and speeds. I wouldn't discount the value of old Allen wrenches as a source for tool steel, you just need to develop a process that doesn't lead to damage of your tooling.

 

[wil]

Hmmmm..I have a lot of old allen keys of various sizes. I never though of grinding them for use as a lathe tool bit...or even a boring bar? Would they work?

 

[goldstar31]

One of my long departed associates used his worn Allen Keys for lathe tooling. He also used spokes for cycles and motor bikes as miniature boring tool material.
He was one of those engineers that understood his trade. He built a Quorn tool and cutter grinder from steel scrap and actually improved it from the original design. He was the sort of engineer who would crack a ball race - and make a special tool- for his gimcrack old lathe.
I think that his party piece was a demonstration of a man being chased by his wife complete with rolling pin followed by a little dog who stopped by a palm tree and the palm tree bent down- and pee'd on him. It made the Model Engineering exhibition.

My father made all his own tooling on the anvil. I still have a little axe that he made for me in 1941. I was 11 and it dug out incendiary bombs in the war. Still got. Again, there is a pinch bar/wrecking bar made from what we called a 'windy pick' blade or pneumatic drill. Pre-war- Swedish steel- would pull the back off a safe! Great!

Somewhere is a bolster chisel from a big bolt. Again, There is a thing called a cow mouthed chisel -again from a bolt and which is probably unobtainable.

Reminiscing a bit, many of the high tensile bolts from car engines are suitable for tooling and some of these old books specify 'broken half shafts' to make collets.
In a more modern approach, Britains potholes are becoming an expensive joke as they a breaking coil springs regularly. Coil springs are nice tool steel!


There is a bit of daft stuff here. A guy casts an arm for a stacking tool arm. Nothing wrong with the concept but my first set came from the conrods on some BMC A Series scrap engine. Somebody had done all the work for me.

I'll get my coat!

Norman

 

[OrangeAlpine]

Years ago, I read about using cheap imported Allen wrenches to make miniature nuts. I guess the quality of cheap imported wrenches has changed.

Bill

 

[Davyboy]

I talked to a fellow that made the miniature nuts and bolts from allen wrenches that he annealed with a torch at his home shop. I have no further details, but he had some cool models.
Davyboy

 

[mcostello]

Over here across the pond Diamond is a very good name for Allen wrenches, should of probably picked something of cheaper quality to modify.

 

[Wagon173]

Sorry, I didn't realize diamond was a brand name. No these were harbor freight allen keys. I never thought about making small nuts and bolts with them. Does he use an arbor press or something? Being a mechanic in the army I change a fair amount of large springs and half shafts. I'm about 6 weeks from getting out so maybe I'll cart several of them home instead of taking them to the scrap pile and save them for a rainy day It's crazy that there are all these secondary uses for things after they're warn out. The bike spokes is another interesting one. I guess I still have a lot to learn. Even still it's been quite a steep learning curve being that I'm all of about 3 months into machining. I was pretty impressed with myself the other day though when I had to make a part that required a rotary table and a saw arbor. I didn't have either so I made a piece to clamp into the vice to act as an axis for the part and then made a 2 tooth arbor saw type thing out of 3/8 drill rod and hardened it. It looked pretty rough but it worked and you wouldn't think it wasn't a real saw to look at the part. For my first tool I was pretty happy that it worked so well. Once I finish the engine I think I'm going to mount the tool in there with it.

 

[goldstar31]

If you are heading for 'freedom' don't forget to cart home a few once good files.

There are two types(I think) one is simply case hardened whilst the best is tool steel- which will make extremely good scrapers and form tools for lathes.

The late and very lamented Professor Dennis H Chaddock- designer of the Quorn tool and cutter grinder used old files to do those dreaded 'ball handles'
The late and almost equally respected David Lammas used old files to overhaul an old Myford lathe. Levelled it with a bit of plate glass- and scraped away with tools which had been 'tempered' finally in his deep freeze.

More modestly, I made lots of parts from an old cast iron surface table.
Cost a huge £3 and a lot of swear words!