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Allis-Chalmers lathe
- Thread starter Richard Hed
- Start date
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ajoeiam
Well-Known Member
I'm a huge fan of the 'old girls' as I call them. (Supporting others' comments made previously.)
But - - - - there is one area where those 'old girls' just aren't that useful.
They quite stink when you absolutely have to have high sfpm (or smpm if you wish) to get a good finish on stuff.
I've used quite a bit of brazed on carbide tooling but I sure don't want to 'have to' use high carbon steel tooling to get a good surface finish.
(I'm thinking of especially when I'm turning aluminum - - - - it really doesn't like slow rpm - - - imo.)
But - - - - there is one area where those 'old girls' just aren't that useful.
They quite stink when you absolutely have to have high sfpm (or smpm if you wish) to get a good finish on stuff.
I've used quite a bit of brazed on carbide tooling but I sure don't want to 'have to' use high carbon steel tooling to get a good surface finish.
(I'm thinking of especially when I'm turning aluminum - - - - it really doesn't like slow rpm - - - imo.)
1951 mgtd. 0-55 in 28 seconds
Kelly
gunner312
gunner312
I have run OLD!! machines and have found that if you take your time you can make tolerance with almost any lathe. I ran one that the ways were so worn that the saddle dropped almost 50 thou in 24 inches of travel. All of the wear was next to the headstock. but I could still keep tolerance and make good parts. It was just knowing where the wear was and taking time. Worked in a flat belt shop once and not a machine was less than 100 years old. Some were so old that I swear they were designed and built by Noah.
MrMetric
Well-Known Member
In my neck of the woods, every third car is a Tesla now. Most of the owners can barely drive (there have been more than a few crashes, including one fatality where the guy (sadly) burned to death after having not paid attention to his car for something like 30 second, and another guy passed out drunk while his car was driving (police cruisers boxed in the car and slowed it down that way... creative)). There is all this yack about how fast they are, etc. I know several people that have them and I've driven around in them before. Sure, they are fast, but you know what? I'd take that classic sports car from the 1950s any day of the week... I would take the Tesla as an everyday car hands down (no Ghost of Lucas), but those MGs are nice. My favorite is the big wheeled MGTC, but the TD has independent suspension so it is supposed to be a lot nicer to drive.
So... 28 seconds, but you do it with style versus the cookie cutter (I'm sure I'll hear from some Tesla owners on that one!)
OK.. How is that for hijacking the thread! Back to the normally scheduled programming (dating myself... now everyone watches on demand).... I really look forward to hearing how the lathe restoration works. As others have suggested, you should join PracticalMachinist. It is a great site, although the owner sometimes is a little testy with hobby users. I think he'd prefer it to be more of a commercial site. Any large machine from yesteryear should suffice though.
Richard Hed
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This one looks somewhat like that, except for it has an electric motor at the top. I'll get the photos soon.
In the first shop I worked in, several of the lathes were flat belt drive but they had an electric motor and a 4 speed transmission mounted on a frame above the headstock, is that what's on yours?
As another diversion from the topic, one of the lathes in that shop came from the streetcar 'barns' after they burned down in 1949. The shop, at the time had a foundry so the city sold it to them as scrap but a job came up and they refitted it. It had a 60" swing, it was for turning the streetcar wheels, and it had a second spindle that had around 24" swing. It had bronze spindle bearings and was powered the same way, with the motor/transmission drive.
Richard Hed
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It's not like that. It looks like something right at the transition from steam to electric in which they simply mounted an electric motor where the steam pulleys had gone. I finally got the photos, so here they come. The lathe, my son found out, is American Tool Works from Cincinnati. Never heard of it but here come the photos.
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Richard Hed
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Actually, they are a lot alike except that the ones in the shop I worked in the mounting was just angle iron weldments and the drive was vee belts to a flat sheave, they possibly got the idea from seeing others like yours.
I remember being told that the shop originally had line shafting so I expect the conversion of at least some of the machines took place about the time your machine was made.
STEVEJ
Member
All I can say about that is that it looks dangerous! Mind your everything. And well done for rescuing it.
She's an old girl, 1900 to WWI. Maybe even earlier. But they were making good lathes during this era. As noted earlier, not speed demons. My father bought a 16 x 60" WWI American Pacemaker from his employer. Motor sat above the headstock, much like yours. Great old lathe, but it would flat wear you out operating it. Very heavily made.
Bill
Bill
Richard Hed
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I haven't rescued it yet, but I will. I have a couple more weeks of harvest work, then I will try to get it. It is going for scrap price but I don't know what that will be yet. The chucks are large enough that it will take a small crane to lift it. Also, the nose attachment is: . . . threads! I was so hoping it would be something else but it is not. THere is a bit of tooling that comes with it but I haven't llookt into the box to see what is with it.
Richard Hed
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It's been sitting there for five years, don't thimk they will melt it yet. I'll have to rent a trailer to get it home.
dnalot
Project of the Month Winner !!!
Looks like a money pit to me. And way to big for model building. An old or older 12" lathe would be a far better choice. I have a Grizzly 12 X 36 and love it. And I have a 1950 Atlas 10 x 36 with gearbox. The Atlas may not be the best lathe ever built but mine works very well and I use it a lot. If you ever move, a 10" lathe its no problem at all. A 12" is much heaver but still easily moved. I know you have been looing for a while Richard but its worth waiting for something better and more suited to your needs.
Mark T
Mark T
Richard Hed
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Well, I don't have a lot of moolah to waste on it. I will get it home and if it is half way decent, I will try to repair what is possible with out spending a fortune. I am not strictly into models so that helps a bit. Also, I am dying of curiosity about this lathe, never heard of the brand and want to examine it in my own bedroom (I'll kik the wife out and put it in HER spot!) There is a bit of tooling that is in a box I would also like to examine. the tooling, if good, might even be worth the whole price. The one thing I dread about this is the spindle nose is "thread" type and the chucks will need a small hoist--they look to be about 70 Lbs. At worst, I can keep the tooling and sell the rest for scrap. I thimk one of the "restorer" guys would like to buy it tho.
toolingjim
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I believe Allis-Chalmers made electric motors starting during WWII. Perhaps that is where the nameplate came from.
The American Toolworks Company still exists, tracing its history back to 1890. They still sell parts for their lathes, though I would doubt they would have parts for one the age of yours. You never know, though. . .
The American Toolworks Company still exists, tracing its history back to 1890. They still sell parts for their lathes, though I would doubt they would have parts for one the age of yours. You never know, though. . .
Harvest? Sounds like you are a farmer. If so, this old girl will do you proud. Very suited to the kind of repair work you probably need to do. Dad decided to rebuild a back hoe. The 16" American (different manufacturer, but very similar machines) was a great match for the 1 1/4" inch pins he had to make.
Bill
Bill
ajoeiam
Well-Known Member
Suggest you don't make the pins.
A great way to rebuild connections on backhoes etc is to just use turned and ground shafting, suggest 4140, and its usually something like 0.0002 to 0.0003" under nominal.
Bore out the rings/plates/whatever to get the holes true and then you can lay in a bushing.
Bushing that you want to last a long time well make the bushing from aluminum bronze - - - - and then use hardened shafting.
(That combination lasts a very long time - - - - aluminum bronze is a lot tougher machining than a straight 660 Naval bronze.)
If you really don't have room to put in bushing well then you need to carefully weld up the holes and then machine your holes square and true.
Its not a tough process just takes some time.
HTH
