Baby lathes, any experience with them?

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nautilus29

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I'm talking about sherlines, taigs , or other brands around the same size. I really like the look and precision of the cowells, but for now that's a dream that is many dollars away. I'd like to know what you feel their capability is when it comes to precision, attachments, and abilities. The sherline has really caught my eye as it seems like a middle ground (not too expensive but not too cheap). I haven't used one though, so I'm not sure if that equates to middle of the ground quality.

Here is a little background. I have an old southbend 9a that shows it's age, but still does it self justice. I also have a harbor freight mill. I can also find time to use the machines at work for projects, so a 13 and 15" clausing also some Bridgeport mills. I got kind of sick of trying to machine 2 and 3mm parts for the stirling engine on a big lathe, and since I have a 9inch already I thought one of these tiny mills would be nice to have around.
 
If you already have a small, 9 inch class, lathe I'd say go for it. I don't personally have one that size but do have a 9x20 HF lathe. Your only other option would be to upgrade the current lathe to perform better with small diameter pieces. By the way another option is an old watch makers lathe.

Frankly I think this comes down to what is in your pocket book, if you are flush for cash then adding more machines to your shop isn't a big deal. It might surprise you but I've seen Sherline tools in large machine shops, sometimes a little lathe is the right solution. The only problem is that you will go through another tool up as the small machines will require their own tooling. So don't forget the added cash you will go through making a lathe ready for your intended usage.

Another option to consider is a DIY solution, buying a head stock form Taig or Sherline and then fabricating the rest. Why would you do this? More rigidity in a small lathe sized or you specific needs. Basically from my perspective the beds on both of these little manual lathes leaves a lot to be desired. In fact some of the old watch makers lathes are just as stiff. Taigs new CNC lathe is interesting but that is CNC. Of course with a larger lathe you should not be in a situation where you are running large pieces on the machine or trying to obtain high material removal rates. The other reason you might want to look at a DIY solutions is your supply of collets, Taig now has a 5C compatible head stock which last I knew they only installed on the CNC lathe.
 
I was considering a watchmakers lathe, but I noticed alot of their crossslides are pretty basic, and I kind of steered away from that option.

The taig option with 5c collets wouldn't be a bad option since I already have a set of those, I'll have to see if you can still put a small 3 jaw on that setup. I'd hate to completely shut down that option. Taigs are amazingly cheap too, so if I end up not being satisfied I'm not out too much. I also found a sherline on Craigslist for a pretty decent price and it comes with a 30 piece set of ww 8mm collets and a 3 jaw. Definitely makes me think about it. I just want to make sure I'm happy with what I get, so I don't want to buy something just because it seems like a good deal and then hate it.

I was considering building my own since their spindle housings are pretty cheap, but I'm worried that by the end of the build I'll have alot of money in beefing one up lol.
 
I have a Sherline Lathe and I can use er16 collets in it, as well as 3 and 4 jaw chucks. It is a very accurate machine. There is a fellow on "another" forum that has built numerouse things, including a Pensy A3 and a Lombard Log Hauling, tracked engine with Sherline equip.

The taig has a wheel type carriage feed, like a big lathe, while the Sherline has a hand crank on the right side of the bed. Both are very accurate, but the Sherline can be more awkward to use if you have the 24" bed, and a bad right shoulder. (Puts hand up)

Tom
 
nautilus29 said:
I was considering a watchmakers lathe, but I noticed alot of their crossslides are pretty basic, and I kind of steered away from that option.
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A watchmakers lathe would be very light duty as most of them have fairly lite spindles. I think it comes down to how much work you intend to do on the unit.
The taig option with 5c collets wouldn't be a bad option since I already have a set of those,
Click to expand...
At least for me there is a big attraction to having a "5C" shop, it is a flexible system. ER isn't bad but unfortunately TAIG uses ER 16 which is a bit small. I just like the idea of buying one set of collets for most needs.
I'll have to see if you can still put a small 3 jaw on that setup. I'd hate to completely shut down that option.
Click to expand...
Chucks are available with a 5C shank. That isn't really a problem and frankly a 5C chuck should be a bit more rigid than one screwed on to an ER spindle.
Taigs are amazingly cheap too, so if I end up not being satisfied I'm not out too much.
Click to expand...
The 5C spindle isn't. Considering what they are describing construction wise though $599 looks like a fair price.

Do understand that it isn't clear from reading TAIGs web site if the 5 C spindle fits their manual machines.
I also found a sherline on Craigslist for a pretty decent price and it comes with a 30 piece set of ww 8mm collets and a 3 jaw. Definitely makes me think about it. I just want to make sure I'm happy with what I get, so I don't want to buy something just because it seems like a good deal and then hate it.
Click to expand...
The have will come from the feel of a small lathe and your ability to adjust to it. Even a 9x20 is a big step up in capability. With these small lathes you need to respect the material removal capabilities.
I was considering building my own since their spindle housings are pretty cheap, but I'm worried that by the end of the build I'll have alot of money in beefing one up lol.
Click to expand...
If you already have a mill and a lathe going DIY isn't out of the question. You could go TAIG compatible for the bed but make it far stiffer or you could go you own route. Lets face it the TAIG bed is a bit short so addressing that might help significantly in usability if not the cramped working area might rub you the wrong way.

In the end I suspect that you will find that such a small machine is very handy for certain aspect of model building even if you spend most of your time at the larger machine. For the last few years I've gone to Cabin Fever and have seen some really amazing work done on these Micro Lathes. Of course the scale of the work is smaller than some of the other things on display but only you know if you are interested in that type of modeling.
 
tms6401 said:
I have a Sherline Lathe and I can use er16 collets in it, as well as 3 and 4 jaw chucks. It is a very accurate machine. There is a fellow on "another" forum that has built numerouse things, including a Pensy A3 and a Lombard Log Hauling, tracked engine with Sherline equip.
Click to expand...
If they fit ones goals these are very high quality machines well worth the investment. Like I said above I've seen the result of the work some guys have done on such lathes, very impressive result can be had. One just has to respect the machines capacity.

The other problem is if you are like me your tools get used for all sorts of projects that don't jive with the original purchase reasoning. This is why I suggest to people that buying the largest lathe they can afford and move in is a good idea. One day you might be fixing the lawn mower the next door knob parts, all the while your modeling waits for your attention while you do the "chores".
The taig has a wheel type carriage feed, like a big lathe, while the Sherline has a hand crank on the right side of the bed. Both are very accurate, but the Sherline can be more awkward to use if you have the 24" bed, and a bad right shoulder. (Puts hand up)

Tom
Click to expand...

Funny you should mention that shoulder issue. I just spent all night at work and are feeling the old tendonitis acting up. Just lifting the right arm to put the keys in ignition needed more effort than normal.
 
tms6401 said:
The taig has a wheel type carriage feed, like a big lathe, while the Sherline has a hand crank on the right side of the bed. Both are very accurate, but the Sherline can be more awkward to use if you have the 24" bed, and a bad right shoulder. (Puts hand up)

Tom
Click to expand...

Tom, Have you had a chance to use a Taig at all? It would be nice to see what someone who uses a sherline thinks of the taigs.



Wizard69. I have been thinking about it, and I could purchase one of these mills and then surface grind a heavy piece of steel to mount it onto. That would probably really help with rigidity, but yet I could always unmount it if I want to machine at the kitchen table(I haven't mentioned that part to my wife yet).

I do really enjoy making the smaller engines and such. I've actually been considering trying to make a watch, although I wouldn't do that until I have more hobby projects under my belt. I get to machine enough large stuff at work that I prefer the smaller stuff for home.

The taig bed size definitely looks short in the picture. Should be fine for almost anything I'd want to do on the lathe, but I do worry about having enough drilling or reaming clearance.

One think that I liked about cowells that I didn't see for sherline is a cross slide mounted milling head. One of the engines I've been looking at building has some small gears and I'd prefer to do everything in one setup if I could.
 
Readers may find interest in in L.C.Mason's Building the Small Lathe book as well as his other books on such topics as model traction engines. I digress but found an article of his on fine finishing turned items.

Again, Martin Cleeve also published an article on how to fabricate a baby lathe in Model Engineer along with such delightful topics as how to buy 'half a lathe', fit two motors, publish a book on screwcutting and make a good living merely producing specialist fasteners.

Having said this, the Unimats have been forgotten and my clock and watchmaking friend has one. Well, so have I if that matters.
Again, Gerald Wingrove wrote up on how he built model cars and Rex Tingey on how to make a little locomotive.

All good stuff that might be valuable to others.

Just to cause a little more searching, I have a Potts spindle - with a set of 8mm collets. It fits a vertical slide from the days not so long ago when milling machines in the home workshop were unheard of.

Norm
 
nautilus29 said:
Tom, Have you had a chance to use a Taig at all? It would be nice to see what someone who uses a sherline thinks of the taigs.
Click to expand...

I am actually thinking of buying a Taig. The main reasons for me would be the the saddle handle being right where it should be (in the front), and the fact that there is a couple of inches extra swing. The larger swing not because I could do bigger work, but because I use the 4 jaw chuck a lot, and I find that many of the pieces I want to do on the Sherline with the four jaw, interfere with the bed so I have to use the 9 x 20 lathe instead.

The Sherline, with it's threading unit, are super useful for those that can't find the nuts and bolts you need. The compound works upside down and I find it awkward.

I have played on the Taig a couple of times. The Taig and the Sherline are both very accurate and usable. The Taig is short, and there is little room to park stuff. The Taig does have a proper compound, but can be not so great for threading.

Two different lathes for different purposes.

I will likely have one of each as they share the same spindle thread and chucks can be interchangeable. At any rate, the Taig chucks are much cheaper than the Sherline.

Cheers

Tom
 
Hi Nautilus29 !
I think you should think about what Wizard 69 said
" Another option to consider is a DIY solution, buying a head stock form Taig or Sherline and then fabricating the rest. Why would you do this? ""
 
Inevitably, the cognoscenti will aspire to buy a Holzapffel in much the same way as we all want a Rolls Royce or perhaps a Mercedes.
I'd happily settle for a Bormilathe or perhaps a Murad Antarctica- me being a simple, romantic soul . Many of my friends/associates have a Myford but add a 10mm Pultra with a Mardrive unit. Regrettably, in some ways, I gave the Mercedes away but I was not expecting to continue model engineering and was pestered and sold my Pultra. Perhaps, not the best but that Smart and Brown has still star quality.
In Pissin' Terms, few lathes will better it. As for Taigs and whatever? You can't be serious?

Oops!

Norm
 
goldstar31 said:
Inevitably, the cognoscenti will aspire to buy a Holzapffel in much the same way as we all want a Rolls Royce or perhaps a Mercedes.
I'd happily settle for a Bormilathe or perhaps a Murad Antarctica- me being a simple, romantic soul . Many of my friends/associates have a Myford but add a 10mm Pultra with a Mardrive unit. Regrettably, in some ways, I gave the Mercedes away but I was not expecting to continue model engineering and was pestered and sold my Pultra. Perhaps, not the best but that Smart and Brown has still star quality.
In Pissin' Terms, few lathes will better it. As for Taigs and whatever? You can't be serious?

Oops!

Norm
Click to expand...

I like the dovetail design of the Murad lathes. Reminds me of the Hardinge lathes I used to run... if they weren't so big I'd buy one in a heartbeat.

How does the unimat that you own now compare to your old pultra? Those pultras look like neat little machines! You also mentioned owning a plotts spindle. Do you own a mill, and if so do you find yourself using the plotts spindle much?

I've been looking at some of the material you posted about building your own lathe. I actually have, available at work, many different sizes of ground stressproof round stock. I could make a lathe in that style for pretty cheap. I just have to decide if that's what I want to spend my time doing. I have a three month old daughter, so hobby time has slowed down some lol. This is why buying new has appealed to me a little more then used or DIY (although I'm still keeping all options open). The idea of getting something in that I can run right out of the box seems nice right now with my limited time.
 
nautilus29 said:
How does the unimat that you own now compare to your old pultra? Those pultras look like neat little machines! You also mentioned owning a plotts spindle. Do you own a mill, and if so do you find yourself using the plotts spindle much?

QUOTE]

The Unimats- and the clone MJ-189 are not in the same league as 'that Pultra'. Having said that, I bought a MJ-189 for £250 and it came with quite a lot of extras. Read Tingey and Wingrove and realise that you have 'something' especially in a crowded life.

The Potts- George Potts of Troutbeck in't Lakes was a superb engineer and there are times when one of my 'Three' Potts( blushes) is ideal.

Finally, I'm sure that we both agree that this is a hobby and 'the family' always must be the first priority.

Kind Regards
Norm
Click to expand...
 
The Unimat 3 was the mini lathe equivalent of the Myford 7 series. Lots of add-ons were described for them. The only possible downside was that the supplied motor (130 w, I seem to remember) was only intermittently rated, 10 minutes on, 10 minutes off. Quite a few users changed the motor for a continuously rated and possibly more powerful item.

Dave
The Emerald Isle
 
I still have a Unimat 4 which I bought about eight years ago. It is not the original Austrian (I believe?) model but it has served me very well and I learned a lot using it. I also made some useful stuff. Although I have a larger lathe now, the Unimat gets plenty of use on the reloading bench.
 
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