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Old 11-28-2016, 08:47 PM   #11
Brian Rupnow
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There is no "backwards" to these engines. Rotation is determined by how you set the exhaust valve to open when setting the valve timing. The intake valve is atmospheric, so needs no cam. You can set these engines up to run either clockwise or counterclockwise. I set my engines up to run clockwise when viewed from the starter hub end, because that way the chuck on my variable speed drill which I use as a starter doesn't loosen off.


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Old 11-28-2016, 09:03 PM   #12
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There is no "backwards" to these engines. Rotation is determined by how you set the exhaust valve to open when setting the valve timing. The intake valve is atmospheric, so needs no cam. You can set these engines up to run either clockwise or counterclockwise. I set my engines up to run clockwise when viewed from the starter hub end, because that way the chuck on my variable speed drill which I use as a starter doesn't loosen off.
Thank you Brian for explaining that. That is exactly why mine is running the direction it is.


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Old 11-28-2016, 09:08 PM   #13
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Jim--I had to open my 3D model of the Kerzel to confirm this--You have two choices when it comes to making the kerzel go into hit and miss mode. You can try and find a pair of weaker tension springs that hold the governor arms together (which is what I did, finally having to wind my own springs from 0.013" guitar strings)---or---you can play around with the weight of the governor weights. From what I see on my solid model, it should be possible to drill and tap both of the governor weights with something like a #6-32 thread, and add washers to each weight until your engine starts to go into hit and miss mode. (the springs are not shown on my model, because they are such a bear to make a model of)---Brian
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Old 11-28-2016, 09:38 PM   #14
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Default Had the same backwards thought myself...

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There is no "backwards" to these engines. Rotation is determined by how you set the exhaust valve to open when setting the valve timing. The intake valve is atmospheric, so needs no cam. You can set these engines up to run either clockwise or counterclockwise. I set my engines up to run clockwise when viewed from the starter hub end, because that way the chuck on my variable speed drill which I use as a starter doesn't loosen off.
since I came from 1:1 scale hit and miss engines. Most if not all of the ones I'm familiar with did run the other way. Obviously doesn't matter I suppose though there may have been logical reasons at one time. Thrust angle on con rod when firing maybe to reduce forces on main bearing caps? Who knows....
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Old 11-28-2016, 09:49 PM   #15
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Full size hit and miss engines were "general purpose" engines, used for everything from buzz saws to water pumps to industrial machinery. I have only had experience with one or two full size hit and miss engines back when I was a kid, and I don't remember now which way they ran. Jim--a question--were you using a Viton o-ring in your Webster, or just a normal black rubber o-ring? I run Viton rings, which are a heat resistant compound, and I have never had one melt.
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Old 11-28-2016, 10:28 PM   #16
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Full size hit and miss engines were "general purpose" engines, used for everything from buzz saws to water pumps to industrial machinery. I have only had experience with one or two full size hit and miss engines back when I was a kid, and I don't remember now which way they ran. Jim--a question--were you using a Viton o-ring in your Webster, or just a normal black rubber o-ring? I run Viton rings, which are a heat resistant compound, and I have never had one melt.
Brian,

I was not using viton in the Webster because I could not find the correct size, however I am using a viton ring in the Kerzel. I'm having too much fun with the Kerzel right now and will get back to the Webster later!

Thank you,

Jim
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Old 11-28-2016, 10:41 PM   #17
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That's correct, you can make it run in any direction you set it up for, but in the hundreds of engines I've seen I've only seen one other run counter clockwise. Depending on the timing may have been why it wouldn't run. Nice build though!

Jim
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Old 11-28-2016, 11:15 PM   #18
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That's correct, you can make it run in any direction you set it up for, but in the hundreds of engines I've seen I've only seen one other run counter clockwise. Depending on the timing may have been why it wouldn't run. Nice build though!

Jim
Engine maker,

Thanks for the kind words . I have 2 full size Hit-miss I restored a while back. One is a 3hp Economy and the other is a 2hp Jacobsen made in my home town around 1920. They both run clockwise. While re-assembling the Economy I realized how important the heft of the flywheels was so I added more weight to the flywheels on the Kerzel and away it went, running great without changing any of the timing.
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Old 11-28-2016, 11:23 PM   #19
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It is considered ill mannered to post a video of your own stuff in somebody else's thread, so I won't do that. However---although I was able to get my Kerzel to pop in and out of hit and miss mode quite nicely, I was never able to get one good, definitive pop, and then a series of misses followed by another good "pop" It runs and it hits and misses, but nowhere near as nicely as many other builds I have seen. I have always put that down to the fact that my Viton ring gives more drag on the piston than a cast iron ring would. I suppose it is possible that the flywheels as per original design are simply not heavy enough. Hmmmm----makes me wonder---My flywheels are currently 3 1/2" diameter, with an aluminum center and a brass outer rim but I could probably find room to put 4 1/2" outer rims on my centers, if I put a riser under the engine base. What diameter are your flywheels? My Kerzel is built to the original scale.--Also--when I look straight down the top of your water reservoir, I can see a flat bottom in there. Doesn't your water jacket go all the way around the cylinder liner? When you look down the top of the water reservoir on my engine you can see the round surface of the cylinder liner.
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Old 11-29-2016, 10:09 PM   #20
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It is considered ill mannered to post a video of your own stuff in somebody else's thread, so I won't do that. However---although I was able to get my Kerzel to pop in and out of hit and miss mode quite nicely, I was never able to get one good, definitive pop, and then a series of misses followed by another good "pop" It runs and it hits and misses, but nowhere near as nicely as many other builds I have seen. I have always put that down to the fact that my Viton ring gives more drag on the piston than a cast iron ring would. I suppose it is possible that the flywheels as per original design are simply not heavy enough. Hmmmm----makes me wonder---My flywheels are currently 3 1/2" diameter, with an aluminum center and a brass outer rim but I could probably find room to put 4 1/2" outer rims on my centers, if I put a riser under the engine base. What diameter are your flywheels? My Kerzel is built to the original scale.--Also--when I look straight down the top of your water reservoir, I can see a flat bottom in there. Doesn't your water jacket go all the way around the cylinder liner? When you look down the top of the water reservoir on my engine you can see the round surface of the cylinder liner.
Hi Brian,

I added a 1/2" ring of brass 3/4" wide to my flywheels so now they are 4" in dia.. To answer your question about the way I did the water reservoir, I was not sure I could seal the head end of the cast iron sleeve the way I machined it. I only milled enough into the top for about an ounce of water. It still only gets up to about 160 degrees when running for long periods of time. I think adding weight and overall dia. to your flywheels will help your hit miss problem. I got mine to hit miss last night for a while but it still doesn't sound like a real full size engine. Perhaps the compression being so low in these small models has something to do with it. My full size Ecomomy Hit-Miss makes several revolutions before firing and when it does it will surprise you with a very loud bark. Of course that's coming from a 1-1/4" x 3' straight pipe! I love to hear that thing run but my dog hates it!

Have a good day,
Jim


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