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Old 10-27-2011, 07:34 PM   #1
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Default Lathe Headstock Bearing Replacement Recommendations?

I have a 1952 Logan lathe with an 11.5" swing. The front spindle bearings are deep groove shielded ball bearings with a 50 x 80 ID x OD. There is a preload on the front and rear bearings supplied by belleville washers. Just wondered what folks in the group would think of replacing those with tapered roller bearings like these:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/32010-Nachi-ed-Roller-Japan-50x80x20-Taper-Bearings-50mm-80mm-20mm-/130573030683?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item1e66c2 551b

Chuck



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Old 10-27-2011, 09:09 PM   #2
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Default Re: Lathe Headstock Bearing Replacement Recommendations?

Are they regular BB?, sounds odd for a lathe spindle, Doesn't everyone use angular contact bearing for a spindle application. Find the numbers on the bearing, and you will know the answer.

Angular contact bearing, have balls and a cage like a regular ball bearing. But the grooves iin the outer race cover about 100° of the ball radius, and the inner race also about 100°, where with regular ball bearings the ball contact area is around 20%. The bearings are select fitted by ball, and race, to millionths inch. A * will mark the high side of the assembled bearing, and if the machine takes 4 bearings at a single point, they are sold as a matched set.

A set of roler bearings, set up perfect, will be out of adjustment as soon as the spindle warms up, now you have a loose spindle with a heavy chuck on the end, going wherever it wants.

not an idea for good machining results.



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Old 10-27-2011, 10:09 PM   #3
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Default Re: Lathe Headstock Bearing Replacement Recommendations?

Near as I can tell, the current bearings are not angular contact. There is one bearing with a snap ring on the front and one bearing on the rear of the headstock. Two Belleville washers apply pressure against the back of the rear bearing and pulling the spindle back against the face of the front bearing. I have found angular contact bearings the right size on Ebay, but they cost from $175 to over $300 apiece. Don't know if I really need that kind of precision...

With the tapered roller bearings, I would continue to use the ball bearing on the rear of the headstock and the belleville washers to apply a constant pull against the font, taper roller bearing. This should keep everything tight with temperature variations.

I've attached a drawing of the current headstock assembly

Chuck

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Old 10-27-2011, 10:16 PM   #4
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Default Re: Lathe Headstock Bearing Replacement Recommendations?

What about lubrication? These tapered bearings are not shielded.
Brock

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Old 10-27-2011, 10:50 PM   #5
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Default Re: Lathe Headstock Bearing Replacement Recommendations?

Why can't you use tapered roller bearing. Or are they not heavy enough.Dale

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Old 10-27-2011, 11:02 PM   #6
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Default Re: Lathe Headstock Bearing Replacement Recommendations?

Quote:
Originally Posted by dalem9
Why can't you use tapered roller bearing. Or are they not heavy enough.Dale
That's what I'm asking... is there any reason I couldn't use tapered roller bearings to replace the existing, deep groove ball bearings?

Quote:
Originally Posted by ShedBoy
What about lubrication? These tapered bearings are not shielded.
Brock
I'm assuming I could just pack the bearings in grease. There is a shield on the spindle which shields the ball bearings.

Thx... Chuck
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Old 10-27-2011, 11:06 PM   #7
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Default Re: Lathe Headstock Bearing Replacement Recommendations?

Chuch My mill and my lathe both have tappered roller bearings in them .Dale

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Old 10-28-2011, 02:08 AM   #8
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Default Re: Lathe Headstock Bearing Replacement Recommendations?

Chuck,

Lots of lathes ....like Harrison and American Pacesetter use taper roller bearings.....Horses for courses.

I would be somewhat suprised if your bearings were not angular contact....but ...deep groove radials do fine for relatively light axial loading...provided they are preloaded ...and with the belevilles....they are.

Now

Why change them?.....the bearings that are in there lasted at least 30 years....at least since the last Logan left the factory anyway....I would say new ones would last a long time.

Regular deep groove conrads will perform better at say 3000 rpm than taper roller grease packs.....nice thing about the conrads is that you could probably get them sealed if your installation allows it and they are real cheap compared to angular contact.


Just my thoughts.....

Dave

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Old 10-28-2011, 04:14 AM   #9
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Default Re: Lathe Headstock Bearing Replacement Recommendations?

I have another lathe headstock for the logan that lets me mount the motor underneath the lathe instead of behind it. Problem is, the replacement headstock bearings feel kind of rough. Could just need cleaning, but I thought I would explore replacing them with tapered roller bearings. Would love to have angular contact bearings, but they are just too expensive.

Part number on the existing front bearing is Fafnir 9110KDDG. These are simply described as deep groove. By the way, the tapered roller bearings on Ebay are about the same price as replacement deep groove bearings, also on Ebay. The only problem is that the tapered roller bearings don't have a snap ring like the replacement deep groove bearings so I'd have to fabricate something.

Chuck

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Old 10-28-2011, 06:50 AM   #10
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Default Re: Lathe Headstock Bearing Replacement Recommendations?

Chuck, Angular contacts are better at handling axial load (thrust against the spindle resulting from feed) than concentric radials (which handle radial thrust better) - but in both cases can be had in metal shielded (ZZ) or rubber sealed (RS) - "sealed for life" already pre-greased.

My choice would be the angular contacts - especially since you have constant running pre-load from the Belville washers

Taper rollers are all good and well but lubrication may prove to be problematical (no seals).
Tapered rollers are highly intollerant of alignment problems (unlikely in your application).

2c Ken



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